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Politics : Evolution -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Brumar89 who wrote (44908)	1/17/2014 8:03:25 PM
From: average joe	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 69300

Ancient fossil found in Canadian Arctic shows evolution from fins to feet: scientists Margaret Munro, Postmedia News \| January 14, 2014 10:53 AM ET More from Postmedia News NATURE/TED DAESCHLER/AFP/Getty ImagesThis undated picture released 05 April 2006 by the British science weekly "Nature" shows the preserved remains of what is described as the "missing evolutionary link" between fish and tetrapods, a four-footed animal that emerged from water dubbed Tiktaalik roseae. A 375-million-year old fish uncovered in the Canadian Arctic a decade ago keeps on giving. Scientists reported Monday that the hind end of the extinct creature, known as Tiktaalik roseae, has revealed a “key link” in the evolution of fins to feet. Tiktaalik had strong, mobile hind fins that it may have used to walk on as it slithered around shallow water and mudflats, say paleontologists. They say Tiktaalik’s large pelvic bones indicate the evolution of “four-wheel drive” locomotion occurred much sooner than believed. “It looks like this shift actually began to happen in fish, not in limbed animals,” team leader Neil Shubin, at the University of Chicago, says in a summary of the findings. Shubin and his colleagues found Tiktaalik in a rich fossil bed on southern Ellesmere Island in 2004. They like to describe the fossilized creature as one of evolutionary biology’s greatest discoveries in recent decades because it provides a rare glimpse into the time when marine species were evolving into four-legged land creatures. The U.S. scientists said in their report Monday that they have agreed to eventually return Tiktaalik to Canada where it will be curated by the Canadian Museum of Nature. But Shubin and his colleagues are still busy mining the fossils, which they wrapped in plaster on Ellesmere and hauled back to Chicago. Along with their science report Monday in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Science, a three-part TV series starring Shubin and Tiktaalik is due to air on PBS in April. Tiktaalik has been making headlines for years based on the scientists’ analysis of the front half of the creature, which looked like a cross between a fish and crocodile with its broad flat head and sharp teeth. Monday’s study deals with the hind end of the creatures, which grew up to three metres long. It says Tiktaalik’s pelvis turns out to be much bigger then expected, with a prominent ball and socket hip joint, which would have been connected by powerful muscles to a mobile femur bone. “This is an amazing pelvis, particularly the hip socket, which is very different from anything that we knew of in the lineage leading up to limbed vertebrates,” co-author Edward Daeschler said in a summary of the findings. The scientists report that Tiktaalik had a combination of primitive and advanced pelvis features and likely used its hind fins like a paddle. “But it’s possible it could walk with them as well,” Shubin says in the release. And “it’s clear that the emphasis on hind appendages and pelvic-propelled locomotion is a trend that began in fish, and was later exaggerated during the origin of tetrapods (four legged creatures),” he says. news.nationalpost.com

To: Brumar89 who wrote (44908)	1/17/2014 9:07:50 PM
From: 2MAR$	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 69300

Just more preprogramed replies you fall back on, what a waste, whats magic again about emergent life taking over 4bil yrs to come about? Its not within your ability to conceive the events of the last week in your own local area, let alone 4bil yrs, so stop with the repetitive meaningless nonsense. Obviously things do emerge, whether unguided or not because there was always that latent potentiality, by many processes we know today that are not magical. Some of us can imagine this vast play of emergence, you cannot even begin to fathom events of the last 50yrs let alone this great reality.

To: Brumar89 who wrote (44908)	1/17/2014 9:27:44 PM
From: 2MAR$	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 69300

Like when you combine the components of a watch and produce a watch, the watch emerged and you can say the watch components had the emergent property to produce a watch...as if "emergence" is some kind of magic that just happens without planning. What bloody nonsense to start with the very complex & think you've won any argument here, as usual without stopping to use your brain for a moment & think how such complexity could emerge. And that over vast periods of time. As for a source for keeping time (and later emergence of your watch), most all life from the beginning is subject to the rythyms of light & dark, revolution of the earth, the entire ecosytem of the earth is dependent on these seasonal cycles & chemical responses of microflora's bloom each year to them. From that world all life is related & emerged. That sense of time & spatial orientation would also emerge as the complexity of the organism does and evolves greater motility & advanced structure to the point of the migrations we see today in mammals & birds to perform the tasks of feeding or procreation. Whether intelligent or not, we are talking about trillions of subtle internal modifications, trial & error from that one great mystery of the first cellular beginnings. How does the watch come into being, because that sense of rythm of those original chemical responses going on, the watch was therefore inside us from the beginning, not metaphorically either.

To: Brumar89 who wrote (44908)	1/17/2014 9:35:43 PM
From: 2MAR$	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 69300

As for keeping time and emergent watches or intelligent design, your problem has to do with white southern baptists inabilty to dance & dont have any rythym or sense of time! There is one dance & it only has only two *steps* in your neck of the woods , that's no surprise! ;o) (but we can always pray you get some soon, perhaps thats why your so angry & contentious , heavy on the arguments & whining, just no sense of rythym so thats all you have left to do is sit stationary & complain?)

To: Brumar89 who wrote (44908)	1/17/2014 10:25:16 PM
From: 2MAR$	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 69300

Hoyle's fallacy : "Ye Old Tornado in the Junkyard" ( how do we say "quackpot" ?) en.wikipedia.org This argument is rejected by the vast majority of biologists. From the modern evolutionary standpoint, while the odds of the sudden construction of higher lifeforms are indeed improbably remote, evolution proceeds in many smaller stages over a long period of time. The transition as a whole is plausible, as each step improves survivability; the 747 is not constructed in one single unlikely event, as the junkyard tornado posits. * Panspermia, fine, then you get the infinite monkey regress....