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Politics : View from the Center and Left -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Steve Lokness who wrote (244199)

2/7/2014 7:54:11 PM

From: koan

Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 542009

And what I am trying to explain to you is basic political science. There is no substitute for democracy and everyone needs to understand that.

You are complaining without having answers.

And yes, civil disobedience is a part of democracy. Here are answers to your questions.

<<Are you saying civil disobedience is a part of democracy? Well then, what is to become of us when those with guns - mostly the right start their civil disobedience?>>

Yes, and you put them in jail.

.........The point I'm trying to make here Koan is that it is a two way street - you don't get to win or get special privileges because you are in the right.>>

NO one expects special privileges!

<<The winner is only those that manage to get the most votes. They win! And if they have the money to persuade the gullible to vote for them they win more.>>

Yes, I know.

<<There is no altruism - in a democracy - and so perhaps it will fail.>.

Not as long as we continue to vote.

<<We vote for that person that gives us the most - be it food stamps or ethanol subsidies. Nobody votes for the environment. Which in the long term, of course, is maybe our most important vote.>>

We liberals constantly vote against our own best interests (higher taxes, programs for the poor), but in the best interest of the individual and society.

Because we understand!

To: Steve Lokness who wrote (244199)	2/7/2014 8:19:44 PM
From: JohnM	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 542009

Are you saying civil disobedience is a part of democracy? That's actually a very good question, Steve. While it's true that civil disobedience has long been a part of American political protest--Martin Luther King is only the most recent, prominent example--that doesn't answer the question as to whether it's a part of democracy. Like democracy, civil disobedience has a long history and a global one at that. I'm sure you know about Ghandi's contribution to it. It's also important to note that it's civil disobedience. It's meant to be nonviolent. And it intends to accomplish its aims as such. Your illustration of the guns is not civil disobedience. We vote for that person that gives us the most - be it food stamps or ethanol subsidies. Nobody votes for the environment. Which in the long term, of course, is maybe our most important vote. Not really. Many of us vote against our own individual interest, at least narrowly construed. We vote for a much stronger and wider national social safety net, for better schools across the country, for better general healthcare that cares for the poor and keeps others from becoming poor because of healthcare costs, and we vote for the environment in so far as that option appears on the ballot. So here I completely disagree. Lots of folks vote that way.