Silicon Investor (SI) -- The First Internet Community

STOCKTALK

We've detected that you're using an ad content blocking browser plug-in or feature. Ads provide a critical source of revenue to the continued operation of Silicon Investor. We ask that you disable ad blocking while on Silicon Investor in the best interests of our community. If you are not using an ad blocker but are still receiving this message, make sure your browser's tracking protection is set to the 'standard' level.

Politics : View from the Center and Left -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: JohnM who wrote (255174)	7/7/2014 12:04:44 PM
From: Wharf Rat	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 542122

"There are a great many very religious folk including the leaders of most of the major Protestant denominations (I refer to them only because I know about them) who are quite enamored with serious science, believers in evolution, and much in favor of much more serious measures to stop global warming than the present administration has put forward" An example, from Oz... Anglican church synod urges Coalition to respect science on climate change Bishop Tom Wilmot says the government has worked to 'denigrate science in general and environmental science in particular' The Anglican Church general synod has unanimously passed a motion urging the federal government to respect the science on climate change. Speaking at the gathering of Anglican diocese representatives in Adelaide, Bishop Tom Wilmot, of Perth, said the dismantling of the Climate Commission proved the Abbott government was not interested in the truth about climate science. Actions taken by the government had instead worked to “denigrate science in general and environmental science in particular, which is being progressively starved of funding and excluded from important decision-making processes”, he said. The synod, which includes bishops, lay and clergy representatives from all 23 Australian dioceses, unanimously passed the climate-change motion presented by Wilmot. The motion states “with deep regret that it is future generations and other forms of life who will bear the real cost of our heavy dependence on carbon-based energy”. It stated as a “grave concern” that a national target of 5% reduction in greenhouse gas emissions from the 2000 level by 2020 was “well short of the response needed to the data presented in the recent report of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change”. The motion also called on individual Anglicans and dioceses to review their commitment to protecting the Earth. The general synod was not the first time Wilmot had spoken out about climate change. He wrote last year that many parishioners were deeply concerned about it and that “the church prays for our elected leaders on a regular basis”. But it appears the passing of the motion has done little to sway the environment minister, Greg Hunt. A spokesman told Guardian Australia: “We do fully accept the science. The problem with the carbon tax is that it has an adverse impact on families, whilst failing to significantly reduce emissions. “We therefore hope the Anglican church will agree that the Coalition’s approach of taking pressure off electricity prices and actually achieving a significant reduction in emissions is a far better policy.” theguardian.com

To: JohnM who wrote (255174)	7/7/2014 12:49:49 PM
From: koan	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 542122

That is not what I had in mind at all. What I had in mind was how dogma trumps education and science around the world; and this dogma is almost always tied to religion which makes it almost impossible to over ride. And the immutable dogma makes it very difficult (almost impossible) for those cultures and countries to evolve fast enough to address the necessary modern problems. You don't see that? What I did have in mind is perfectly described by what we see going on in the Middle east. Total chaos caused by cultures who value religion over education. Those are 7th century cultures cemented with religious dogma so strong neither democracy, science or new ideas seems able to penetrate it. And so they not only seem incapable of establishing democracies, they seem incapable of doing any of the things necessary to save the planet, like get control of their population. We see the same thing in the south American countries where the church forbids birth control and education is subordinate to religion, or in Africa where the church forbids using condoms even to prevent AIDS (state of mind). I am talking about major cultural mediums (The medium is the message!), the way in which cultural evolution manifests. A good example of how this works is that in the middle east 95% of the people think you have to be religious to be a good person. But in China it is 14%. In the US it is 53%. I don't think you would deny that it is culture of religion in the middle east (Pakistan/Afghanistan, etc) that is preventing both democracy and education from flowering and making it impossible for them to adapt to the modern world in a way that is necessary. While in China they celebrate science and as they don't have religious dogma to overcome can evolve very quickly. This has nothing to do with some people you know who have managed to integrate science and religion. This is the worldwide problem of religious dogma versus education and science. And I am surprised you don't seem to see the same picture I have painted above. It is a pretty simple concept I would expect a man of your intelligence and education to see as easily as the light of day. PS and I never saw a scientist get upset because of an equation they didn't like. And I am simply presenting an equation. l << This distinction is far too simple. There are a great many very religious folk including the leaders of most of the major Protestant denominations (I refer to them only because I know about them) who are quite enamored with serious science, believers in evolution, and much in favor of much more serious measures to stop global warming than the present administration has put forward. By the same token, there are many quite religious scientists. I knew two faculties rather well in the past century. There were quite a few dedicated scientists on those faculties who were quite serious about their religion. You have in mind a certain form of religion, generally fundamentalist, literalistic.