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To: Sidney Reilly who wrote (10776)	1/16/1998 2:21:00 PM
From: Sidney Reilly	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 39621

When Jesus came as Messiah Ben Joseph (the suffering Messiah) Israel was looking for Messiah Ben David (the glorious Messiah) to deliver them from the Roman occupation. They didn't know how well the Romans served God's plan and that God even raised up the Romans for that purpose. As Marvin Rosenthal explains so well: ******************* It was "the fullness of time" because of Roman roads. It was, in the first century, no empty cliche to say, "All roads lead to Rome," for wherever her armies marched in conquest, her engineers went to build the roads.But those roads would fulfill another purpose. They would literally pave the way for the disciples, who would be under soveriegn orders to go "into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature" (Mark 16:15). It was "the fulness of time" because of the Pax Romana. The worldwide Roman peace was a parenthesis within a long corridor of almost endless wars. It too would afford the disciples great latitude in traveling from country to country. The Roman peace, even if it was compulsory, aided and abetted the early church in its proclamation of the One who alone is the Prince of Peace. It was "the fulness of time" because of the Greek language and culture. When the armies of Alexander the Great marched in the third century before Christ in conquest of the bodies of men, his philosophers marches along side to conquer the minds of men. As a result, when the Son of God appeared on the stage of planet Earth, the Greek language and culture came to dominate much of the world. This commonality of language and philosophy, like the roads that linked the nations and the forced peace that subjugated them, would aid the spread of the gospel. Unlike twentieth century missionaries, who spend years in language study and cultural familiarization, for the first century missionaries, the Greek language which they spoke was ideal, and cultural shock between nations was minimized. In large measure, those things contributed immensely to the rapid spread of the first century church. But the Roman roads, the Roman peace, and the Greek language would have meant little were it not for a fourth reality that characterized that era of history. It was the "fulness of time" because there was also a religious expectation in the hearts of men. Even secular historians suggest that there was a spiritual vacuum, a hungering and thirsting for something more. The "mystery" religions of the Roman world did not work; paganism provided no real satisfaction; and the unbridled licentiousness of much of the idolatrous worship was abhorrent even to some of the more noble pagan souls. In some vauge way, unregenerate men began to sense that it was a special moment in history, that diety was going to visit humanity. For those attuned to scripural truth, that moment in history was not vague at all. They knew that the sixty-ninth week of Daniel's prophecy (comprising 483 years), which foretold that the Messiah was to be "cut off" (crucified) was at hand (Dan. 9:25-26)." excerpt from "The Pre-Wrath Rapture of the Church" by Marvin Rosenthal *********************** The Jewish leadership and many of the people wanted Messiah Ben David (the glorious Messiah) to come and deliver them from the Roman occupation and were not prepared to accept Messiah Ben Joseph (the suffering Messiah). Jesus told His disciples in Matt. 16:21-23 that He was to suffer and Peter did not want to accept that at first. Now the next Messiah that Israel will see will be Messiah Ben David but they will also realize He is Messiah Ben Joseph who they have rejected. This was God's plan as He stated in Isaiah 65:1 "I permitted Myself to be sought by those who did not ask for Me; I permitted Myself to be found by those who did not seek me. I said, "Here I am, here I am", to a nation which did not call on My name."

To: Sidney Reilly who wrote (10776)	1/16/1998 3:46:00 PM
From: Emile Vidrine	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 39621

Mr. Rosenthal has blended the intent of the holy prophets of God with the intent of the unholy and antichrist talmudic sages of modern Judaism. The Holy Prophets of God clearly saw the Church Age-the Kingdom of God-- because they possessed the Faith of Abraham, the same Faith that is the foundation of the Church age. The spirit of the Old Testament is the same spirit of the New Testament. The God of the Old Testament is the same God of the New Testament. Jesus is the God of the old and New Testament. The sages of antichrist modern Judaism use these satanic inspired discussions in the Talmud to justify the antichrist behaviour and beliefs of modern Judaism. Mr. Rosenthal equates the Prophets of God in the Old Testament with the antichrist talmudic Rabbis of modern Judaism . He does this by beginning his paragraph by discussing the views of the Prophets and then in the middle of the paragraph shifting to the ancient Jewish sages (the antichrist rabbinical writers of the Talmud), thus implying that the two sources are the same. The ancient sages of modern Judaism refer to the writers of the antichrist Babylonian Talmud but the Christian reader is lead to believe that the two are the same. He begins with: "The prophets rightly understood that the Messiah.. Then in the middle of the paragraph he shifts to the antichrist rabbinical view of the writers of the Talmud. Since ancient Jewish sages were at a loss on how to reconcile the incongruity of suffering and glory and the time sequence of these events, for some of them, at least, there could be but one solution. There must be two Messiahs. One they chose to call Messiah Ben Joseph (Christ, the Son of Joseph). The other they called Messiah Ben Davis (Christ, the Son of David)." ----------------------------------------------------------------------Here are the key misconceptions of Mr. Rosenthal's essay. Their problem, however, related to the chronology of these events, and then to the fact that the description of suffering and glory for the Messiah appeared incongruous-absurd, incompatible, inappropriate. The ancient prophets could not comprehend the relation of these two events to one another. They had no concept of the church age, which spanned the two peaks and has already lasted almost two millennia. It is not the ancient prophets who had "problems", "could not comprehen", "had no concept of the Church Age", but the false Talmudic rabbis who rejected Jesus and invented their "Jewish Fables" to explain their evil rejection. Christ is Lord and eternal King of Israel--all who believe in His Holy name. The King and Messiah who will return is the same Jesus who ascended into heaven almost 2000 years ago.