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Politics : View from the Center and Left -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Wharf Rat who wrote (405263)	4/12/2019 11:05:29 AM
From: koan	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 541479

It wasn't religion that made the Jews so smart, it was the fact they discovered and embraced the power of education long before almost any other society. They have been Europe's intellectuals for around three thousand years. They educated their people who became the west's entrepreneurs, bankers and accountants when the rest of the people were planting potatoes. And still today the worlds Jews are leaders in education. Their culture as you well know, demands educational excellence from their tribe. Their religion actually holds them back, as seen by the five times Netanyahu has been elected by the religious right wing in Israel! There are as many liberal Jews, as religious right wing Jews. And that dichotomy causes tensions in their tribe.

To: Wharf Rat who wrote (405263)	4/12/2019 11:13:22 AM
From: epicure	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 541479

So the Jews really are to blame for everything: "It wasn't the church that gave us democracy (Jews did that), ethics(Jews did that) , the scientific method and our modern civilization" Now we know. LOL This isn't any more true than white men giving us "modern civilization". But since modern civilization is probably going to kill us, when you find those responsible, you've found the folks who will probably destroy humanity...

To: Wharf Rat who wrote (405263)	4/12/2019 12:15:10 PM
From: cosmicforce	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 541479

That is a little ethnocentric. Sanskrit and Sumerian predated Hebrew by a couple of thousand years. So maybe Hebrew is the oldest and most consistently written and spoken contemporary Western languages but then again, there is Chinese, predating Hebrew by at least 400 years. While Sanskrit is largely religious - Chinese is not. What I'm hearing is a utilitarian argument is that because a technology is ASSOCIATED with a culture and religion, that it is BECAUSE of the religion. An interesting conjecture, but hardly scientific - Post hoc, ergo propter hoc So, Rat, can we say because Jews didn't eat lobster or clams, that there is no value in them? Or it's converse, that only goats and sheep have value because they were associated with being Jewish? Did God know about tomatoes and just forget to put them into a Kosher / Not Kosher bucket? My position is that religion may be catalytic and transformative in a historic context, but when it isn't, it usually is reactionary and not embracing change. That is the very nature of religion - to be timeless. More often than not that means being trapped in time like the Mennonites or Orthodox Jews who find clever ways of tricking God to avoid "work" during Shabbat. If I were God and looked at the "indirect action" ruse that is in the modern Hasidic world - I'd be pretty much like: "Really?! You guys have some of the great minds of logic and science and you think THAT is what I meant?!" myjewishlearning.com 5 Must Have Gadgets for Shabbat-Observant Jews From a foldable hot plate to a Shabbat light bulb, these devices help make the Sabbath easier for observant Jews.