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Politics : View from the Center and Left -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: epicure who wrote (479306)

9/10/2021 1:12:24 PM

From: koan

1 Recommendation

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Maple MAGA

Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 541777

I don't even know how to respond? Is that a threat?

Would you resort to that, for a person who is simply trying to explain another point of view, based on humanity, the military and sociological point of view, that so many credible people agree with?.

You "demand" what, that I buy into your perception of the world? You know that makes no sense. We all have different opinions, and I am quite sure what I post will turn out to be correct.

And I am a hard core liberal Democrat and probably more of a Democrat than some of those protesting.

I agree we should never have gone into Afghanistan, or Iraq, or Viet Nam, but we have been in Afghanistan for 20 years and that makes a difference. We "owe' these people to a large degree and especially those who helped us over the years at risk to their lives.

That is a matter of honor, and to just leave them there is shameful.

I can see past the NAME Afghanistan, to the millions of children and females that have not grown up in the old harsh Afghanistan, so won't know how to endure it, and will suffer soooo much under these thugs.

Everything I have posted is the absolute truth, so what, people don't want to face the truth, so you want me to quit posting it? Is that the idea?

And I think you have it wrong about the Trump/Biden connection. Yes, Trump turned the country over to the Taliban, and that is what makes him so horrible, but Biden didn't have to agree with that. They were not the nation, they are just a bunch of thugs.

IMO, Biden wanted to USE that as an excuse to leave and he did not even do the basic thing of making sure he had the immigration in place before doing it. He just left and never gave a thought to what would happen to the people he left behind.

You say you don't give a shit about Afghanistan. How am I suppose to buy into that? These are human beings and no less important than us. I do give a shit what happens to them and worry about them.

If that is a sin, I accept it.

The difference between Afghanistan and North Korea, or many other failed states is that we had a 20 year relationship with these people and we "owed" them. We don't know or owe North Korea.

There is a great piece in the BBC yesterday about what has changed in Afghanistan in the last 20 years and they talk about all the female doctors and engineers and teachers that have been born where before NO females were even allowed to go to school, or work. That is progress for the planet.

We spent 20 years helping this backward nation gain a good degree of civility and now we just throw them back to the wolves. I am not OK with that.

And how can you blame the children and women and other helpless people for what their leaders failed to do?

<,

Koan, I have been told this is an echo chamber in no uncertain terms so I DEMAND you echo me- now, repeat after me- "After Trump gave the country to the Taliban the battle for Afghanistan was lost- all Biden could do was get the US out as quickly and as painlessly as possible". Did he do that? I sure think he did. You may disagree around the edges of how we exited- though with your lack of military experience, I'm not sure why I would listen to you. Afghanistan is no more a "hostage" of the Taliban than any other country with a horrible government. North Korea, for example. Those people are even more terrorized and brutalized than the Afghans- but you don't go on and on about them all the time.

At some point you have to say, "It was stupid to go into Afghanistan and it was stupid to stay there." Biden will probably be praised as the man who dared to get us out of the mire- a mire that showed no signs of firming up. I get it- you would have spent more and more money there, at the expense of all the things you claim we need right here, in the US.

End of the day, Koan, Afghanistan is for Afghans- and it is THEIR country. The US tried to help them for TWENTY years- and trillions of dollars. I weep for that money that could have been spent here. If I'm honest, I don't give a shit about Afghanistan and I do wish the US had spent all that lovely money making sure the US wasn't a sad, ungovernable shithole instead of wasting it overseas. So many of the problems we see here could be partially fixed by better infrastructure and even- gasp- better education (though possibly of a different sort than you envision. I'm thinking of really targeted job training to get some of those fucking incels out of their basement lairs and into good employment so they have less time to fiddle around with their Proud Boy buddies on the net.)