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Politics : Politics for Pros- moderated -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: TimF who wrote (777198)	2/7/2023 10:22:57 AM
From: IC720	2 Recommendations Recommended By alanrs Winfastorlose Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 794216

Others here are much more educated since 2014. Winn's been following since... Few articles and history of... (lower article) "This war in Ukraine is an invasion of Ukrainian into the regions that were formerly the Russian Empire. They were never under some sovereignty of Ukraine that never existed. The West simply wants to destroy Russia, This has been on the agenda for decades and the fall of communism never changed that policy. They will do the same with China. In truth, this is Ukrainians invading the Russian territory where Russians have lived for centuries. The propaganda has flipped this completely around claiming Putin is invading Ukraine when they began this civil war in 2014 and launched the first attacks on the Donbas." ... The Ukrainian government briefly allied itself with Poland, but could not withstand the Soviet assault. In 1922, Ukraine became one of the original constituent republics of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics (USSR); it would not regain its independence until the USSR’s collapse in 1991. Ukraine was NEVER a standalone sovereign nation. It was the territory of one of the major powers. That is why they joined the German Nazi movement and began their own ethnic cleansing to exterminate everyone in the region who they regarded were not pure-blood Ukrainians. It was Hitler who promised them the right to carve out their own country. This is why the first coinage of Ukraine was that of the German Nazi occupation. And as for Kiev, it was founded by the Russ – the Russians. It was destroyed by the Mongol invasion in 1240AD and all that stands today is the golden gate. The Russians finally reestablished their capitol giving birth to Moscow. So sorry, the Ukrainians were the Cossacks which were a roaming tribe that has no actual nation-state. While the hatred of Polish, Russian, and Austrian-Hungarian peoples in the region stems from their subservient position to one major power to another, it was Stalin who saw the failure of Communism and then stole the food from Ukraine creating the Holodomor where up to 7 million died of starvation. The hatred of anyone other than Ukrainian has been a major issue in Ukraine. Within Ukraine, there are indigenous peoples that nobody mentions. There are three ethnic groups that do not have a mother state but have occupied Ukraine for centuries. This applies to the Crimean Tatars, Karaites, and Krymchaks. armstrongeconomics.com This war in Ukraine is an invasion of Ukrainian into the regions that were formerly the Russian Empire. They were never under some sovereignty of Ukraine that never existed. The West simply wants to destroy Russia, This has been on the agenda for decades and the fall of communism never changed that policy. They will do the same with China. In truth, this is Ukrainians invading the Russian territory where Russians have lived for centuries. The propaganda has flipped this completely around claiming Putin is invading Ukraine when they began this civil war in 2014 and launched the first attacks on the Donbas. The treatment of Polish, Jews, and Russians during WWII even horrified the German Nazis. Why would Poland ever support Ukraine can only be that its leaders are told what to say and do by those behind NATO seeking World War III. The Polish people should wake up for they will be the next to be thrown on this altar of geopolitical sacrifice. The Polish Association of Memory of Victims of Crimes of Ukrainian Nationalists documented 135 methods of torture and murder practiced by Ukrainian Nazis. Poland officially called the Ukrainian actions genocide. The Ukrainians have been protected by the CIA for decades ONLY because they hated Russians. They continue to protect the Ukrainian Nazis only because they are waging war against Russia. No Ukrainian was ever prosecuted for war crimes that made the German Nazis look like amateurs. The Ukrainians were unprecedented in their war crimes during WWII and the sheer outright cruelty has NEVER been addressed. They above all should have been hunted down more so than the Germans. The torture Ukrainians inflicted even on Polish and Hungarians along with Russians and Jews included: Running children through with stakes Cutting a person’s throat and pulling their tongue out through the hole Sawing a person’s torso in half with a carpenter’s saw Cutting open the belly of a woman in an advanced stage of pregnancy, removing the fetus, and replacing it with a live cat, before sewing up her abdomen. Cutting open a pregnant women’s abdomen and pouring in broken glass Nailing a small child to a door. All the various wars and history of this region are included in the databanks of Socrates. That is how it was able to pinpoint Ukraine as the hot spot where all this will unfold as we warned in 2013. There is no account of war crimes that has EVER surpassed those inflicted by Ukrainians. It is an embarrassment that Europe and the USA would support Ukraine in this land grab. As for those that blame everything on Putin, get your head out of the sand and open your eyes for you are a casualty of this propaganda to promote WWIII. The very people who live in that region predominantly support Russia against Ukraine. armstrongeconomics.com

To: TimF who wrote (777198)	2/7/2023 10:45:15 AM
From: skinowski	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 794216

>>>> The people of Donbas were condemned to a war by Putin in 2014.<<< This may be a correct statement, but perhaps, not for the reasons you think. The annexation of Crimea by Russia - because of the real concern about the West, likely, making sure they lose their naval bases on the peninsula - took away about 2 million Russian speakers - and made it certain that pro-Russian voters in Ukraine would forever remain a despised and oppressed minority. Indeed, one of the very first steps by the new regime was to outlaw Russian as one of the official languages. That bothered a lot the Russians living in Lugansk and Donbass. They knew they were in trouble. Another factor that contributed to their problems was Russia’s indecisiveness. They refused to annex those regions (trying to play “nice” with Ukraine and the West) - AND refused to support those Ukr Russians more decisively. I understand, there is some bad blood among the people over there towards Russia over this abandonment. —————— Let me tell you… your confidence about your assertions and generalizations is quite astonishing. When thinking or writing about complex issues, I struggle trying to integrate those millions of moving parts into a statement that can be communicated to others. I try to be as careful as I can. I know this annoys some people reading my posts. But, that’s how it is. You, OTOH, usually come off quite definitive. Often wrong (imho) - but never in doubt.