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Non-Tech : Datek Brokerage $9.95 a trade -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Peter Stern who wrote (6977)	2/25/1998 1:19:00 PM
From: Jon Tara	Respond to of 16892

I've always thought that this business with the customer having to be aware of all the different web servers was silly. And it's getting even more silly by the minute. There are solutions that will load-balance servers without using redirects and without the user having to be aware of anything. It's done in the router. Netscape, Microsoft, Wall Street Journal, etc. wouldn't be able to operate their web servers without this technology. Not sure why Datek can't use it. And don't understand at all why it's necessary to have separate servers for different interfaces. This should be no more than a (overridable) user preference, which should take effect on whatever server you happen to be connected to. The ONLY justification for a separate server running a specific interface is express. But then, this could be handled transparantly, as well. Ah, well, I suppose this will all happen around the time we get option trading, and get rid of the stupid Java Dilbert Quotes on the home page. (on the latter - is this really the impression you want to give to new customers - do you really want their first experience with Datek to be having to experience an inordinate delay while Java loads, only so that they can see some mythical Dilbert indices in real-time? Has there been a Dilbert episode yet on gratuitious use of Java or senseless marketing partnerships that hurt more than they help?)

To: Peter Stern who wrote (6977)	2/25/1998 1:39:00 PM
From: Scott	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 16892

Peter, It's good that you are working with us to improve the interface. You shouldn't have to take the verbal abuse you are getting in this forum. It's not like you're the Cable Company, or the IRS :-) My biggest problem with the "New Classic" servers (orders2) is that, as I mentioned in a previous posting, my orders were in "Not Placed" status on the Daily Activity screen for almost 30 seconds after I entered them. One time I entered a duplicate, because I thought the first order wasn't placed. This is a serious problem. The other thing I don't like is that the confirmation screen only lists the "Market Price," and not the Bid/Ask that the Classic screens show. So, if you could flatten the fractions, post orders instantly, and show Bid/Ask on confirmation, I would be happy with the "New-Classic" interface. Note that I use orders7 quite a bit for fast moving trades, so please keep that in its current format. Scott

To: Peter Stern who wrote (6977)	2/25/1998 3:47:00 PM
From: David Kuspa	Respond to of 16892

Peter, I'm still waiting for your reply to the security flaw/inconsistency I discovered in your interface. I sent you a "private message" via Silicon Investor, because I did not want to post this info publicly. Please respond to me via email and I'll explain it to you. dkuspa@home.com

To: Peter Stern who wrote (6977)	2/26/1998 5:28:00 AM
From: Rene Madsen	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 16892

Datek: I just had a look at the "new classic" pages (orders 8) as it looks this Thursday morning. It's a rather nice compromise - only one thing I would REALLY like you to change: COULD YOU LEFT-ALIGN the TICKER NAMES? Please! I don't know who decided to center-align them, but it's very difficult to "skim" the tickers when getting quotes for several stocks in one go. About the pseudo load balancing you are attempting to do by having users click a button: 1) As it has been pointed out by at least one other poster, the PROFESSIONAL way of load balancing is by letting the router deal with it. The cost and effort of this is really quite minor - have you at least checked it out? 2) If you INSIST on using this kind of pseudo load balancing, at least provide a page for the button that doesn't take ages to load - i.e. No graphics, no java, just a button. PLEASE!

To: Peter Stern who wrote (6977)	2/26/1998 8:22:00 AM
From: Scott Pedigo	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 16892

<<...the login buttons are your best way to connect to web sites>> If I bookmark a link to orders.datek.com (but not to a specific server such as orders3.datek.com), then doesn't this have the same effect as using the log-in button, as far as assigning me to the least-loaded (new) classic server? The only difference is that I get prompted for the user name and password only after I click on a button for my portfolio, or to get quotes. Right?

To: Peter Stern who wrote (6977)	2/26/1998 8:53:00 AM
From: Scott Pedigo	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 16892

Up till now, I've avoided joining in to the chorus of rants, and have been content to simply continue using the old classic servers. But this morning, to my dismay, I find that they have all been done away with, leaving only new classic and non-classic servers. Somebody at Datek must be a big fan of Beavis and Butt-head, but especially Beavis. I remember not very long ago being reassured that the classic servers would remain. The implication was that the old classic servers would remain indefinitely, since when that assurance was first given, there was no new classic. This turns out to have been a lie. Beavis: "Yeah, yeah, heh-heh lyin's cool..." The new classic may have a better "back end" than the old classic but the user interface is UGLY and HARDER TO READ. Perhaps beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I'm not a teenager wearing grunge clothes, pants 20 sizes too big, a nose ring, with a Billy Idol buzz cut. Just a 40-something Levi's and sweatshirt wearing, Coke-guzzling software engineer without the gen-x aesthetic that ugly is beautiful. I like clean lines, symmetry, and simplicity. (1) I cannot use the new interface at all. Period. Black on black menus. I can't get a new browser either. I'm one of the few people using a SPARCstation 10 running Solaris 2.3, and only Netscape 3.0 is available. Netscape 4.0 is supported only for Solaris 2.4 and higher. Don't tell me that I have to buy a new workstation, new operating system, and new browser, just to get your pages to work. (2) There is an enormous amount of space wasted around the buttons and entry forms on the new classic orders page. The hideous green border is bigger than the labels and entry windows, making the whole affair take 2x the vertical space necessary. (3) The fonts have been made smaller, and therefore harder to read. If this were to save space, it might be acceptable, but any space saved was wasted (see above). Personally, I'd rather have the old slightly larger font. If I want to fit more on my screen, I can edit the font options in Netscape. (4) The lack of cell borders and the poor alignment of the text in the quotes, makes them harder to scan. Why can't you at leave at least one of the original servers with the original interface? If it is overloaded with users, then that is a message to you. Datek has essentially issued an ultimatum to its customers - new classic: take it or leave. Ultimatums are almost always a bad idea. This isn't the army. We're customers.

To: Peter Stern who wrote (6977)	2/26/1998 9:06:00 AM
From: Jason Rooks	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 16892

Peter Stern, I believe Scott has raised an important point: why has the old interface been replaced? I do not believe you need to respond to each complaint about the new interfaces, but do believe you should answer Scott's question.

To: Peter Stern who wrote (6977)	2/26/1998 10:09:00 AM
From: JK	Respond to of 16892

Help!- I'm going blind. The new format on the old classic servers stinks. Why not the old format without the logo. Also, put it on a couple of new servers. This is ridiculous! JK

To: Peter Stern who wrote (6977)	2/26/1998 1:29:00 PM
From: trung nguyen	Respond to of 16892

Peter/DATEK, I'm not happy with what I saw when I log in this morning. Why screwed around and forced things that a fairly good representation of your customers loudly said they don't want. What is your problems ? You want us to make trades and yet you are making the environment in which we trades less and less pleasant. I have three accounts and I will move them all out if things continue to deteriorate for me here. Have you ever heard of the phrase "The customer is always right." ? What I want ? I want DATEK to provide me with the trading interface I had been using for the last 13 months. One more pissed-off and very unhappy customer.

To: Peter Stern who wrote (6977)	2/27/1998 12:55:00 AM
From: facai	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 16892

Peter, Thanks for doing an excellent job...except for one thing: please bring back the old interface(for DatekOnline Classic). It's like a taste thing (remember Coke?).

To: Peter Stern who wrote (6977)	3/1/1998 2:01:00 PM
From: Gorak Shep	Respond to of 16892

Peter, a few minor errors to report for quotes on the new servers: 1) some negative Change values have 2 minus signs eg INTC "--2 5/8", MSFT "--3/4" 2) 0 Change reports as a single minus eg LEAF "-" 3) the ALT in the IMG tags for Down Ticks is ALT="UP"

To: Peter Stern who wrote (6977)	3/3/1998 9:10:00 AM
From: Gorak Shep	Respond to of 16892

Peter, is there some reason the change column in quotes uses fancy fractions on orders6, a new classic server? Thanks for getting rid of this on the other classic servers. Could you fix this last one too?

To: Peter Stern who wrote (6977)	3/3/1998 9:15:00 AM
From: Rene Madsen	Respond to of 16892

... and we still need to get those symbols LEFT-ALIGNED please.

To: Peter Stern who wrote (6977)	3/4/1998 9:57:00 AM
From: Bushy	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 16892

Peter, I like the way orders6 is setup. It downloads fast and is easy to read. Placing orders, on orders6, seems to give fast affirmation too. I've been with you for over a year now. You've improved many things in that time and getting better. Thanks Bushy

To: Peter Stern who wrote (6977)	3/4/1998 6:44:00 PM
From: Gorak Shep	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 16892

Peter, Datek's Technical Difficulties web page is missing a TABLE End Tag and thus comes up as a blank page in Netscape 4.04. Just got this on orders7. I've gotten this blank page before and just decided to figure out why.

To: Peter Stern who wrote (6977)	3/5/1998 11:19:00 AM
From: David Kuspa	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 16892

Peter Stern has not responded to my private message regarding a security issue/irregularity I've discovered on the Datek site, so I'll post my discovery here. Since he has not responded, this seems to be the only way to get Datek's attention and also to verify with other account users that the problem exists. Hopefully, this information will not be of much help to a hacker since it isn't a total security failure, but at the very least it is an inconsistency that is worrisome. Passwords should use both alpha and numeric characters for highest security, so my password is an alphanumeric string. Simple words or combinations of letters are fairly easy for a hacker to break by brute force "guessing", from what I understand. By accident, I discovered that I have access to my Datek account by only typing in the alpha characters, leaving the numerics off. To me, this means the security is half-compromised. Using the partial password allows me to get quotes, as well as view my portfolio and its history. To my relief, I still must enter the full password to send an order in. Will others please verify this irregularity/inconsistency? I haven't checked all the possible access points, but even one inconsistency is worrisome to me and makes me wonder about the security integrity for the site. This also makes me a little nervous that many of us had publicly posted part of our user names earlier for Peter's poll. I know it's not the entire user name or password, but a good chunk of it is vulnerable from what I see, and I don't want ANY of it to be any easier to hack. D. Kuspa