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Strategies & Market Trends : Level II Trading -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: stuart who wrote (359)	3/11/1998 7:41:00 AM
From: DRRISK	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 1086

I think that if he (MM) is not hit electronically that he can sell with out refreshing. I am not sure of this though. Then he can hide his true share size better. If I am interested in a stock I will sometimes hit a MM who moves the stock off the ask on Selectnet and see their response. The other case is I can follow their frecuency to the ASK or BID which indicates their appearance on the Inside bid or ask and hence a relative measure of selling or buying. The Refresh can also be useful and I will hit an important MM that is alone on the inside ask and see how rapidly they refresh. All these are tools to keep an eye on our little friends the MM's. When I take a position like OXHP I will follow all these components as closely as possible for any clues in sentiment change in these market movers. DrRisk

To: stuart who wrote (359)	3/11/1998 7:09:00 PM
From: Dan Duchardt	Respond to of 1086

stuart, and all >>concerning refreshing... for example... a mm may show his bid size as 10 (1000 shares), if he gets hit electronically for 1000 shares he gets knocked out of the box and must refresh to get back into the que.<<< I believe this part of your statement is not quite accurate. There is a period of time the MM has to refresh his quote (17 sec) if he wants to stay in the queue. During this time he will still appear at the inside market, but will not be active for SOES until he refreshes. When the market starts to move, it's a guess whether the MMs at the inside are active, or have already been hit and are deciding to refresh or change their quote. >>>if he gets back in at the same price and size the inference is that the mm's order was larger than he cares to show.<<< This often is the case. A heavyweight like Goldman sometimes sits alone at the inside market taking numerous hits without ever moving. Now a question about the refresh we see on a ticker or time and sales. Does this only happen after a SOES execution, or does it happen after other executions such as Selectnet?? I think it is only SOES. Anyone??