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Pastimes : The Grafted Tree (Gentile's & Jews learn from each other) -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Ga Bard who wrote (370)	4/13/1998 1:44:00 AM
From: Qone0	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 702

You jamed my printer. LOL....There is a lot of knowledge shown in these questions,leading the witness so to speak. The first three questions are same, by passing over others belief's you show that your own belief or faith in your belief is week. " Which one is the right one to save a soul in heaven?" You save your own soul it is your choice, god or satan it is that simple. "Can i play the devils advocate and not be call satan?" some would say no i would say yes. " Is it really the religious cult or name of an organization or belief by which the chararcter of a person of a person is based on?" Belief " Does being a spiritual man have a religion since i believe in any belief that causes mankind or a small portion of there to be and act within a standard world wide moral behavior?" Moral = laws transgression of the law is sin. Who makes the laws,hiltler though killing millions of jews was moral. Hitler was a spiritual man an evil spirt but still spiritual. There are many spirits be carfull which one you hear. There is no world wide moral behavior never has been never will. I will continue down the list tommorow night expound on these as you wish.

To: Ga Bard who wrote (370)	4/13/1998 2:58:00 AM
From: craig shipman	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 702

WHEW!! The length of your list is overwhelming! I had supposed that the purpose of your questions was to gain insight, knowledge, or understanding. I regret that I do not have the time to express my opinions for the sake of conversation and discussion. Even so, if you could narrow your list down to those questions which are of spiritual significance to you, I would be glad to give you my prayerfully considered response. Shalom, Craig

To: Ga Bard who wrote (370)	4/13/1998 3:53:00 PM
From: Alan Markoff	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 702

Dear GaBard, I wrote answers to your questions last night and the power went out and the computer lost everything I had written so I worked on it again this morning and it did it again and the electric company had to repair a pole by our house. This will be the 3rd time I will attempt to share some thoughts with you. I am not really qualified to answer your question but will share what I think. <<I wonder why you pass over some, is it because you do not wish to open a thought to another view or belief?>> Maybe it is more neglegence than intent. <<Does passing over the view, logic or belief or someone else effectively do anything other than show you as a close minded individual?>> The Lord may not be teaching them in that area and they may not have an opinion at that time. <<How do you learn by passing over others beliefs, views and or opinions?>> Again I think they may be at a different place than you are and not have an answer. <<Which one is the right one to save a soul in heaven?>> God is the only one that can save a soul. If they are in Heaven they are already saved. <<Can I play devil's advocate and not be called Satan?>> That is a common idiom in our language and should be accepted at that only. <<Is it really the religious cult or name of an organization or the belief by which the character of a person is based on?>> The character and belief of a person is affected by these but the fact that they are drawn them shows that they lean that way spiritualy. The character of teh person is judges by God alone. << Does being a spiritual man have a religion since I believe in any belief that causes mankind or a small portion of there to be and act within a standard world wide moral behavior?>> We are spiritual but it is corruptable without a rebirth from the Holy Spirit of God. No matter how hard we try to be good and think we are good we will screw up and miss the mark without the wisdom of God and His Spirit. <<I wonder what is the difference between a religion and a cult?>> They are very similar but hopefuly a religion will emphasize a personal relationship with Jesus where a cult will make up allot of rules from a persons interpretation of the scriptures. << Are ghosts those spirits that were not good enough for heaven but too good for hell so trapped here on earth? Do they think if so how?>> There is nothing in the Bible about ghost so any information I would have would be based on other people who are in reality clueless about the spiritual world. Demons are mentioned allot and it states they are the angels that fell with Lucifer. <<If I were a perfect human would I been also possibly considered a son of God???>> No, Yeshua had to be born under a series of covenants and a long planned out redemption by the Father. No one could fill His place and no one unless they were conceived of the Holy Spirit could be perfect. <<What organized religion was Jesus?>> Jesus was called a Rabbi by many Jewish people so He would have participated in Judaism. <<Is religion and the soul in the afterlife really important to know?>> If it wasn't the Bible would probably not mention it. But it does and does it allot so we should consider it important. <<If there is a rational thought pocess after death in the spirtual form can not sin exist?>> We will be changed to be like Him and uncorruptable in Spirit. <<If you are a man of moral character and you have no formal religion but live a life defined within all doctrines as a good man are you in fact a religious person? >> Religion is a pettern of beief so if you have no particular pattern I would say you are just a good man. Remember I see knowing God as a personal relationship not a religion. <<Now if Mary was fertilized by a holy spirit then does not sin exist in the spiritual world? >> Is reproduction a sin? How do you think she became pregnant? Can we question a God that created a Universe as to sin? <<Is there also not conception of new born spirits in the spiritual world? >> I don't know how we are born again I just know it happened to me. <<Where does spirits or souls come from?>> According to scripture Adams body was lifeless until God breathed His Spirit into him. << That is the teaching but what was the condition of the corpse on the third day? >> The body is in decay by the third day. <<I take it you believe the body metaphorized into a spirit right?>> I need the context on this one. << Is not sitting on a throne of this world however the bible says nothing of this world? >> Again there are many types of thrones mentioned in the Bible and I would need more information to answer this. <<What is to stop Jesus from ascending and fertilizing a virgin here on earth making Jehovah a grandfather?>> This is the only question that I do not care to answer. << How do you know Jesus was not an alien?>> He had a mother. <<Believe in who the supreme diety or the man titled son? >> This is not clear to me. <<Well if they kill off the souls that do not believe in them where does Jove acquire new souls for the new borns here on earth? >> When I can create a soul I could answer how it is done. <<Did not the hebrew belief change after Jesus was born?>> Not that I am aware of. <<Did not the Jews express the man titled son of god concept? >> Jesus introduced that concept to my understanding. There is a verse in Proverbs that says and, what is the name of His son tell me if you know. <<Would you be open to a grandson?>> Why? Jesus said it is finished and it is. <<What is the difference between a cult and a religion?>> I have already answered this. <<Why did Hilter kill so many Jews?>> I believe satan used him to try to stop the rebirth of the nation that followed shortly. <<Why are there so many different religions and or cults?>> Because tehre are so many different people. <<Does individualism create philosophy which creates religious beliefs?>> It may but it does not creat a personl relationship with a Holy God. <<Do people of a certain religion consider another religion basphemy?>> Some do and some are. <<Is a difference thought, voice or view sacrilege?>> It depends on the thought. <<Does a blind faith sheep follower consdier ant thought outside there own regilionism?>> Usually, all like sheep have gone astray. Even if we desire to stay on track we are wonderers by nature. <<Are some religious where others are righteous where even more are spiritual?>> It depends on how you classify each. To me they are very different. Religous is following rules of a group that seek God. Righteous is a king, loving and generous person (we need Jesus to be rigteous) Spiritual is a part of our being that is conected to the spirit world. <<Why are Jews so persecuted for believeing in a diety that has no name but this same diety has a lot names in other religions??>> I am not convenced it is the same diety. The persecution is not new and has been stated as the enemies of God not other followers by a different name. <<Why does God have to have a image if so what color is that image which of the races on earth is his perfect image?>> Jesus was born a Jew for reasons of His plan and was more on a spiritual promise to Abraham than on physical appearance. <<Is it possible that within the spiritual realm, since there is apparently a heaven and a hell, other realms which are governed by deities? >> Again not mentioned in the Bible so all answers would be speculation and dangerous. <<Could the spiritual world not be sectioned off as our world is?>> There are levels of Angels we have Archangels and we have the Son of God so there is an order but the rest I can not say. <<Certain books of the bible are omitted : I & II Esdras, Tobit, Judith, Parts of Esther & Daniel, Wisdom of Solomon, Ecclesiasticus, Baruch, Prayer of Manasses, I & II Maccabees.... Why?>> I don't even know where some of these come from and just don't know other than if God wanted them there they would most deffinately be there. <<Do you even know what the books I mentioned that are conviently omited are called? >> No idea. <<Do you know why they were omitted fo the Christian bible?>> No. <<Ok then who are the Jews worshiping?>> The God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. <<This execution is the basis for the Gentile belief is it not? >> I need more information. <<Did Jesus die for our sins well I do not know but who will shed blood to cleanse us of 2000 years of sin now?>> Jesus said it is finished. <<Was Jesus a mere earthly representation to give Christianity something they could touch and see in order to justify the Gentile belief?>> No, He carried upon Him the sins of the world and He said for this hour I have come. <<Is or does Jesus sit on the right hand side of God?>> He does <<Now if this is the truth then they are two separate entities are they not, yet the same Gentile's express that God and Jesus are one?>> A wife is seperate from her husband but the Bible says the 2 shall become one. There is a spiritual connection. <<Was Jesus a Jew or a Christian?>> They put a plaque over Him that said King of the Jews. <<Ok now wait are you stating that the holy spirit, Jesus and God are one?>> Yes <<Does it make a pagan that I am a poet and I have read some of Robert Graves writings on Mythology, Poetry, Prose, Translation and Fiction which he has a writing of King Jesus in it which I have not read?>> Jesus said it is not what goes into a man that makes him unclean but what comes out. <<I will ask for clarification since Christainity was not in existence at the time of the execution and is not plsams 22 in the Old testament? >> Psalm 22 has inspired many Jewish people to believe in Jesus as their Messiah. Clearly it is a description of a crucifixion before they had them. The other verses with it is the timeline in Daniel chapter 9. The Holy One would be cut off before the destruction of the second Temple. Jesus was the only candidate for that time frame. <<Can you see now the questions are to spark discussion and not something else?>> Are you really seeking answers ? <<Was the "King of Jews" over Jesus' head a crime declaration or a ridicule since the Jews rejected Jesus as their King?>> It was the only crime the Romans could find Him guilty of. <<Do you not find it amazing that the pagan ritual is now a national holiday and gentiles teach their children this horrible pagan ritual as part of their hertitage?>> Which ritual are you referring to. I have not seen many that are that horrible, I avoid some on a personal conviction but do not critisize others for them <<What is your opinion or religious concept of the shunning of Jesus by the Jews and why is this one factor such a major problem?>> In Romans 11 Paul says there is a hardening in part on the Jews for the sake of the Gentiles iuntil the ful number come in. Then all Israel will be saved. In Peter it says they were predestined to stumble in this area.There is a plan Bard and it will all be clear when teh time comes, but for now we are to have faith in Him and seek to walk with Him in a personal relationship that requires belief in Jesus as the Lord, prayer, study and fellowship with other believers IMO. Please ask God for He has all the answers and loves you very much. Nancy P.S. I was unable to check the spelling.

To: Ga Bard who wrote (370)	4/14/1998 1:22:00 AM
From: Jamey	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 702

GaBard, I have always been honest with my beliefs about Jesus. If I see the kind of questions that I feel are ambiguous I go to the literal word contained in the Holy Bible. You stated that you were set in your beliefs and from your questions I assume that does not include Christianity. To be a Christian, it takes more than good moral fiber and living a good life. If you deny the existence of Jesus as the Son of God than it is plain that you are probably a new ager. (Or an old ager with new ideas.HA!) We have been under constant attack over the last few months from Satanists, witches, White Supremists and New Age advocates that have dragged our Lord through some of the foulest insinuations I have ever heard of. The others know what I am talking about and who I am referring to. Now you started out by stating that "no one would change your beliefs" so wouldn't you admit that your line of questions are to belittle our Lord? Some of your statements include...... "Does being a spiritual man have a religion since I believe in any belief that causes mankind or a small portion of there to be and act within a standard world wide moral behavior?" "Now if Mary was fertilized by a holy spirit then does not sin exist in the spiritual world?" "What is to stop Jesus from ascending and fertilizing a virgin here on earth making Jehovah a grandfather?" "How do you know Jesus was not an alien?" "Would you be open to a grandson?" I'm not going to take the time to find all of your questions that IMO was rude and out of place on a thread that is known for its beliefs in Jesus Christ. Jane also had every right to question your motives as she has been under heavy attack because she loves the Lord and will not allow this type of discourse to go on without standing up. If every one else wants to be tolerant of this line its ok with me. I simply will not post here any more. But, I know where you are going with this tack and I do not care for it. Regards, James

To: Ga Bard who wrote (370)	4/14/1998 2:54:00 AM
From: craig shipman	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 702

Ga Bard, I chose this question to give a brief response to: "Which one is the right one to save a soul in heaven?" A soul can only be saved by the One who breathes life into it. Shalom, Craig

To: Ga Bard who wrote (370)	4/14/1998 10:58:00 PM
From: craig shipman	Respond to of 702

GaBard, I chose this question to respond to: Is a difference thought, voice or view sacrilege? It is inevitable that there will be differences in opinion regarding the interpretation of Scripture. The danger lies in teaching the theories and opinions of men as the doctrine of our Heavenly Father. We should be careful not to fall into the trap of seeking the approval of those who might agree with our opinions. We are told to STUDY THE SCRIPTURES to determine if we have received the teaching of our Heavenly Father. He will not hold blameless the one who does not seek HIS instruction, HIS correction, HIS approval, for He is a jealous Elohim. Shalom, Craig