[HVAC] Discussions about HVAC, Elevators etc at the WTC
To me it seems the elevators at the WTC are no problem. Here is a description of the systems controlling the HVAC in the WTC etc. Lots of computerisation; so they will be doing quite some testing.
Technical but interesting.
John
________
'RonKenyon <ronkenyon@aol.com> wrote in article
<1998051522265200.SAA04238@ladder01.news.aol.com>...
> Stephen Poley wrote:
> >>>I know it's a little off the topic you were actually discussing, but I
> >>>can give one concrete example. The lifts in the passenger terminal at
> >>>Amsterdam airport
> < ... >
>
> Did anyone ever track down make-or-break details on the reported NY World
Trade
> Center elevator test? Harlan?
> -- RonKenyon
Here's some of the correspondence:
-----Original Message-----
From: Harlan Smith [SMTP:hwsmith.XOUT@cris.com]
Sent: Saturday, April 11, 1998 3:05 PM
To: 'berengaria.winkler.XOUT@nordstrom.com'
Subject: WTC Elevator Story doesn't check out, so far
Berengaria,
[snip]
Although I do not have a written review of the test conducted at the World
Trade Center, the test example was presented at a recent Year 2000 forum
that my manager and I attended. Recently the facilities and operations
group at the World Trade Center, ran year 2000 tests on 2 of their main
elevators. They rolled the internal clock, the elevator went up, came down
and turned itself off. When they went back into the system to turn the
clock back to present time, the embedded chip would not take. What was
supposed to be a 2 hour test, turned into a lengthy night run to remove the
embedded chip, find a replacement and set the new embedded chip before the
work day began. For clarity and details about the test procedures that they
used, I would advise contacting the World Trade Center directly.
I have found in my research as project analyst for this project, that the
IEEE professional organization has not taken the opportunity to take the
stage on the embedded system and year 2000 issue. I am quite surprized, as
their English counterpart, the IEE in England, has posted on their web site
and is selling a recent publication on the very topic. I have ordered the
publication, and it has proved to be very useful, as my colleagues in
facilities and operations were looking for this very material. I would
advise visiting the IEE web site: www.iee.org.uk. - BW
[end snip]
We have contacted WTC and they say that the incident did not occur and that
they are just now commencing Y2K testing.
Also, there are supposed to be 275 Otis elevators in the WTC and Otis
claims complete compliance.
Now they do have a big control system strapped on the WTC and I rather
suspect it does have problems.
Can you please identify the specific conference and also the speaker who
related this tale?
Harlan Smith
-----Original Message-----
From: berengaria.winkler.XOUT@nordstrom.com
Sent: Thursday, April 16, 1998 7:25 PM
To: hwsmith.XOUT@cris.com
Subject: RE: Elevator Test Example - Resource
Mr. Smith: I apologize for not getting back to you earlier this week; I
have been out of town and subsequently catching up with pressing items.
I have, in addition to your inquiry, received another question about this
very facility test that I heard about at a conference presentation. As I
stated in my initial note at the on-line conference, the information
regarding the World Trade Center Tower elevator test, was presented as an
example at a conference I attended here in Seattle.
Please note, I encourage direct inquiry to the facility and elevator
manufacturer, but for clarification, that I should have stated in my
initial message, I received this information at the Gartner Group Strategic
Forum, "Year 2000: The Landscape is Changing!" - presented by John Bace of
the Gartner Group. In the meeting materials, the following number is given
for inquiries to the Gartner Group Year 2000 client service, (203)316-1255.
You may be able to directly inquire via this number.
We have not as yet tested any of our elevators, but may conduct such tests
-pending the inquiry completion we have with our vendors. If there is any
other information and resources that I may provide, please feel free to
contact me. Thank you , and I hope that this has been helpful as well as
providing some clarification.
Berengaria
Berengaria Winkler
NORDSTROM Year 2000 Project Office
(206)233-5718 Fax: (206)233-6352
Tie Line: 8-891-5718
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Harlan Smith [SMTP:hwsmith@cris.com]
> Sent: Saturday, April 11, 1998 1:05 PM
> To: 'berengaria.winkler.XOUT@nordstrom.com'
> Subject: WTC Elevator Story doesn't check out, so far
>
> Berengaria,
>
> [snip]
> Although I do not have a written review of the test conducted at the
> World
> Trade Center, the test example was presented at a recent Year 2000
> forum
> that my manager and I attended. Recently the facilities and operations
>
> group at the World Trade Center, ran year 2000 tests on 2 of their
> main
> elevators. They rolled the internal clock, the elevator went up, came
> down
> and turned itself off. When they went back into the system to turn the
>
> clock back to present time, the embedded chip would not take. What was
>
> supposed to be a 2 hour test, turned into a lengthy night run to
> remove the
> embedded chip, find a replacement and set the new embedded chip before
> the
> work day began. For clarity and details about the test procedures that
> they
> used, I would advise contacting the World Trade Center directly.
>
> I have found in my research as project analyst for this project, that
> the
> IEEE professional organization has not taken the opportunity to take
> the
> stage on the embedded system and year 2000 issue. I am quite
> surprized, as
> their English counterpart, the IEE in England, has posted on their web
> site
> and is selling a recent publication on the very topic. I have ordered
> the
> publication, and it has proved to be very useful, as my colleagues in
> facilities and operations were looking for this very material. I would
>
> advise visiting the IEE web site: www.iee.org.uk. - BW
> [end snip]
>
> We have contacted WTC and they say that the indcident did not occur
> and
> that they are just now commencing Y2K testing.
>
> Also, there are supposed to be 275 Otis elevators in the WTC and Otis
> claims complete compliance.
>
> Now they do have a big control system strapped on the WTC and I rather
>
> suspect it does have problems.
>
> Can you please identify the specific conference and also the speaker
> who
> related this tale?
>
> Harlan Smith
Subject: Re: OTIS Elevator and Y2K
From: "Harlan Smith" <hwsmith.nowhere@cris.com>
Date: 1998/04/10
Message-ID: <01bd649b$097f7b60$46969bcf@CRC3.concentric.net>
Newsgroups: comp.software.year-2000,comp.arch.embedded
[More Headers]
[Subscribe to comp.software.year-2000]
Here's some more on WTC
hsq.com
[snip]
HSQ Technology Delivers Operations Control Center to World Trade Center
In May of 1997, HSQ Technology delivered a Building Management and
Supervisory Control and Data Acquisition System (SCADA) to the Port
Authority of New York and New Jersey for the World Trade Center (WTC) in
New York City.
HSQ's MISER SCADA software and hardware package is located in the
Operations and Control Center (OCC) of the WTC and functions as a complete
Building Management System (BMS), coordinating the operations of the other
building control and monitoring subsystems.
The World Trade Center is a very large complex of five buildings consisting
of two 110 story towers (including 6 sub-grade levels each), two 10 story
buildings, and the Concourse. The towers and Concourse portion of the
Center were completed in 1973. Each tower is 1,350 feet (410 meters) tall,
second in height only to Chicago's Sears Tower.
Design Criteria
In March of 1996, the Port Authority issued a Request for Proposal (RFP)
for the design and implementation of the OCC/BMS project. In the RFP, the
NYNJPA set four main goals:
Provide a central command center to improve the performance and monitoring
of all base building and emergency systems. Provide areas from which to
coordinate emergency response activities. Ensure that no single event
would impair communications, control and monitoring functions. Provide
flexibility for future adaptation to new technology and growth.
HSQ's proposal met the requirements of the RFP which covered previous
experience, systems integration, capabilities and understanding of these
types of applications. HSQ's many years of experience, coupled with our
MISER software and hardware products, allowed us to propose a system that
would meet and exceed the WTC requirements.
The HSQ model 2500/86 Logic Processor is used to monitor base building
alarms and Chiller performance monitoring instruments. The system is
designed to support future plans for energy management.
Project Scope
HSQ Technology was awarded the OCC/BMS design/build project, and the
contract was signed in September of 1996. HSQ's proposal was based on HSQ's
MISER software and Model 2500/86 Logic Processor RTUs. MISER will provide a
central monitoring, control and information access facility for the
following subsystems:
Elevator Monitoring and Control
Escalator Monitoring
Electrical Power Substation Monitoring and Control
Base Building Alarm System
Chiller Performance Monitoring System and HVAC Energy Management System
Communication System
Interface to a Work Order Management Software Package
Interface to Existing Mainframe
Project Implementation
The delivered system consists of two main SCADA servers, 16 workstations,
two system consoles, four printers, two terminal servers, Ethernet
repeaters, hubs and associated LAN hardware, modems, facsimiles, and
audio/visual equipment distributed throughout the different rooms.
Communications between the different systems is via a fiber-based Campus
Area Network (CAN). Originally, the CAN communications network was not part
of this contract. However, the Port Authority has expanded the scope of the
project to include the CAN System to be installed by HSQ. HSQ provided a
100 Mbps fiber optic ring multiplexor and Ethernet communications.
The Operations Control Center
The OCC (Operations Control Center) serves the following functions:
Operations Control
Performs day-to-day and emergency operations.
Emergency Operations
Functions as the communications center.
Tenant Liaison
Manages communications during emergencies.
The MISER SCADA system will interface to the elevator control and
monitoring system. The WTC complex has 240 elevators and 48 Elevator
Machine/Control Rooms. The Port Authority is in the process of upgrading
the elevator controls. In the first stage, MISER will interface to 35
elevators. Other elevators will be added to the MISER system as they are
upgraded. These controls include car leveling, door timing, floor bypass
and emergency operation.
HSQ's SCADA system also monitors all 71 escalators distributed throughout
the complex. The SCADA system monitors the operational state of the
escalator (running or not running), direction of travel, and the presence
of one of eight alarms. No control functions are envisioned at this time.
The WTC complex is served by an electrical distribution system consisting
of 23 substations. Of these, 16 substations are located in the towers, each
tower having 8 substations. Six of these have been upgraded to include
digital devices such as power meters and digital protective relays. HSQ's
MISER SCADA collects, processes and stores digital/analog data from the
power meters, protective relays and other field devices. MISER utilizes the
CAN System to communicate with these devices using SEAbus protocol. In the
future, all substations will be upgraded and MISER will be communicating
with all 23 substations.
The installed MISER system interfaces to approximately 385 alarm sensors
strategically located throughout the building. The interface to the MISER
system is through HSQ 2500/86 Remote Terminal Units (RTUs) that gather all
the sensor data and transfer it to the main control center by means of the
existing shielded twisted pair and via the fiber optic backbone network.
The HSQ RTUs are designed to easily increase the number of alarm points
that can display as the future need increases, and also to provide an
interface for future energy management and control functions.
All alarms display at the individual Operator workstations. Alarms are
color-coded and blink accordingly. By looking at the screen, an operator
can easily identify the type of alarm, date and time that the alarm
occurred, and which device caused the alarm. Alarms can be identified by
priority or group, allowing the operator to easily identify alarms which
have a high priority, markedly simplifying the operator's job. The User can
build alarm displays for specific building functions or physical areas, or
modify existing ones. MISER also provides advanced alarm processing
functions such as historical archiving and reporting. Current alarms and
historical alarm data can be printed or exported to other commercially
available standard software packages for further analysis.
Since awarding the contract to HSQ, the Port Authority has expanded the
scope of the project to include the Chiller Performance Monitoring System.
In addition, there are plans to interface the HVAC Control System with
HSQ's MISER system in the future.
[end snip]
It wouldn't be surprising if there was a Y2k problem lurking somewhere in
all this mess would it?
---
Harlan
Date: 08-May-98 17:43:03 MsgID: MC2-3C6E-C3B5 ToID: 71530,1637
From: Alan Reiss >INTERNET:AReiss.XOUT@PANYNJ.GOV
Subj: Year 2000 - World Trade Center Elevators
Form: Memo
Text: (40 lines follow)
Dear Mr. Harlan Smith:
I was recently given a copy of what looks like a CompuServe forum message
dated 3/24/98, # 10449 concerning y2k tests on the main elevators here. I
do
not what forum you attended where this information was presented but it is
completely false. I was the supervising engineer for the World Trade up
until the terrorist bombing, at which I took on the task of project
director
managing the reconstruction of the subgrade & infrastructure, then took
over
as the manager of the Capital programs for the World Trade Center. I
selected the elevator modernization contractor & the controls currently
being installed.
The original elevators at the WTC installed by Otis used relay logic
controls with some transistor & Diode - Transistor Logic. This stuff was
installed in the late 60's. It is really remarkable how well things work
with "ancient technology". These units used tork time clocks to shift
operation based on the time of day with cams.
In 1994 we began modernizing the 246 elevators at the WTC with
microprocessor controls made by Computerized Elevator Controls. It is a non
proprietary system. The system is called Swift Futura. To date only 7 of
the
46 "main" cars are modernized. They do not have a date function, though we
are preparing to run and certify Y2K compliance tests with our contractor &
consultant this year. The vendor has already told us they are complaint but
we are from Missouri.
There was no test, elevator recall, shutdown etc. We may elevator problems
due to the sway of a 110 story building and what it does to elevators but
we sure don't have the Y2K problem you mentioned.
We are in fact lucky that we are just modernizing systems such as fire
alarms and elevators rather than having done it in the 80's and then put a
system that has a problem. For example most of the HVAC controls are still
pneumatic. they don't care what the calendar sys.
Alan Reiss
General Manager
WTC Operations, Life Safety & Security
Use Proportional Font: true
**Primary Recipient:
[71530,1637]
**CCs to:
Theodore Stam INTERNET:TStam.XOUT@PANYNJ.GOV
But, after all this, there are still questions remaining. Where did John
Bace, Director of Research at Gartner Group report that tale and where did
he get that information? Before this is put fully to bed, I think we need
an input from John Bace.
Harlan
___
Subject:
Re: Electric Utilities vs Fear Mongers
Date:
16 May 1998 02:25:17 EDT
From:
"Harlan Smith" <hwsmith.nowhere@cris.com>
Organization:
Paperless
Newsgroups:
comp.software.year-2000
References:
1 , 2
|
