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To: IngotWeTrust who wrote (14381)	7/10/1998 8:23:00 PM
From: Amelia Carhartt	Respond to of 116756

49r: Thank you so much for your post re:derivatives. It's true and it really made me laugh. I am always grateful for humor especially involving dark subjects. You gotta laugh! Susan

To: IngotWeTrust who wrote (14381)	7/10/1998 10:01:00 PM
From: IngotWeTrust	Respond to of 116756

Thx, twas onna roll! Sometimes I just can't help but Bobbit! Have a great weekend. I AM! O/49r

To: IngotWeTrust who wrote (14381)	7/16/1998 4:05:00 PM
From: Defrocked	Respond to of 116756

Instead of trading insults I'll provide additional facts. If you still disagree fine. Bad management, lack of oversight and rising interest rates caused Orange County's $1.6 billion portfolio losses, not derivatives. Robert Citron lost $1.6 billion dollars on a leveraged yield curve bet and did so under "supervision" by the County Board. The County Board did not ask the right questions concerning his activities, such as "If we are making all these extra returns above the bill rate, are we also exposed to extra risk???" When interest rates were dropping the portfolio performance looked great. Citron and the Board were credited with saving the County. As rates increased, however, fund performance quickly soured and the finger pointing started. But Robert Citron was soooo smart, when asked about his portfolio activities he responded, "Given the situation, I'd do it the same way all over again." BTW, Citron could have placed the same bets in the cash market but it would have cost Orange County even more due to the higher transactions costs. (One can even argue that Citron "saved" the County money by using derivatives instead of the cash market.) washingtonpost.com The Orange County debacle provides an analog for many other "derivative scandals". Bad management, poor risk analysis, lack of oversight. Then the true underlying risk gets exposed and derivatives take the blame. I'm relieved that you're a big time "derivs player" and hope you've made a fortune at it in pursuit of personal gain, of course, at the expense of the counterparty. Good luck to you and your hundred lot orders. PS.if the "fantasy baseball Jr. Griffey deriv" was mispriced in size I would trade it ...providing the counterparty rating was acceptable.<g>