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Gold/Mining/Energy : Crystallex (KRY) -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Avalon who wrote (9572)	8/1/1998 10:31:00 AM
From: John Soileau	Respond to of 10836

John, your assumption is that everyone who held onto KRY listened to Carson...to that I say BS. **This is the old change the opposing thesis and then attack the changed thesis style of argument. I neither assumed nor said "everyone" listened to Carson. I said your statement must be viewed in its historical context. With respect to my own posts...you are again trying the old Jerry Collins routine whereby you try and blame someone who express their opinion about a KRY win in an effort to hype or influencing others. Carson's posts, and yours, speak for themselves. Reread them and honestly evaluate whether it is reasonable to state that they were NOT an "effort" to "influence" others. You saw the opinions of walter, charred, valentine,viper and so many more on the anti-KRY side Yes and I saw posters ATTACKED AND INSULTED for questioning the party line. Read some old SI posts: 4206 4209 4309 4312 4315 4319 4409 4410 4304 4305 (a "you are a moron" post; wasn't Collins recently called a moron here as well?). and you also have apparently seen that pro-KRY opinions from myself, Mesa, etc. etc.... were you influenced enough by anyone's opinions to take an actual position either short or long in KRY? From what I have seen of your posts, the answer seems to be an unqualified NO! I was not influenced by the pro-KRYers. I had no interest in the stock and never bought it. I have never shorted any stock at all, not sure I even know how to do so. I have been interested in the THREAD, though, as an ongoing drama. While I wasn't whipped into screaming enthusiasm, in my opinion others were. Read back into the thread and you'll see what I mean. So..if you were not influenced by the pro or anti-KRY rhetoric, why do you assume that everyone who held was influenced by the pro-KRY side and not by their own personal beliefs? "Everyone"? See above. I do believe people were influenced by material posted here, yes, and that opposing arguments were discouraged and treated as heresy. Your statement that investors could have sold at a profit after mid-January should be evaluated in this context. That's my point,which i hope is pretty clear. Is your constitution somehow stronger than others? From what I have seen of what you write...and the opinions (I use the term loosely) you express, the answer is again an unqualified NO! We agree!! My constitution is no better than any other. Been there done that is helpful though. For example, I bit it on Fairmile...believed Mr. Chelekis and joined the mantra chanters on the thread. Maybe even attacked a nonbeliever or two. I entirely lost any disinterested perspective, loved the stock, believed all positive and disbelieved all negative information almost as an instinct. Refused to sell at a profit since the train was always about to leave the station. KRY is no Fairmile and Carson is no Chelekis but IMO the "fall in love" syndrome (it really ought to have a name!)was happening bigtime on this thread. Even ECharters (who gallantly tried to give a reality check to a few other threads and was attacked with incredible viciousness for it), seemed romantically involved with this stock. I have to fight every day to just LIKE my stocks, and stay out of a serious relationship! You're absolutely right I'm no better than you or others. Just maybe more battered. Anyone who cannot make up their own minds as to the investments they choose should consider mutual funds IMO. A good point. Just don't fall in love with the mutual fund!** John

To: Avalon who wrote (9572)	8/1/1998 2:18:00 PM
From: Jerry Collins	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 10836

Avalon -- You state quite eloquently an argument that a single individual's posts would probably not (or should not) have much bearing on another's investment decisions, with particular reference to Internet chat groups. Where your argument breaks down is in the aspect of the policing role that some posters have adopted when presented with particularly problematic posts of others. I'm not talking about Shorty's old "KRY is going dooooowwwwwwwwwwwn!!" posts of a few months back. Rather, there has been an obvious pattern of deliberate expulsions or attempted expulsions from forums of people who bring along solid information that is rejected as being that of some sort of a viral "agenda." When I first joined another forum as anonymous GSTQ, I arrived specifically to address some of the hairier aspects of what Roy Carson in particular was offering in terms of sheer nonsense. My first post was to ask whatever happened to the then-recent issue of what Stockwatch had discovered was Carson's misquoting of Congressman Alvarez (or at least, Mr Alvarez denied he said what Carson attributed to him). As I pursued this line of questioning in very matter-of-fact way, that is unaccusingly, Carson suddenly went silent. But then came Avalon, and your post to me was as swift as it was aggressive. You wanted to know why I thought the Alvarez issue was so important, and you wanted to know who I was and what was my "agenda." This is hardly what I'd call a very helpful course for the free exchange of views, and it did not help those investors who were reading the forum in order to hear "both sides." A suspicious person might have been led to believe (as he still might) that those kinds of forums are rigged into only allowing "approved" comments pass. For those on the wrong side of the debate, it's the big flame, suspicions of being part of a short-selling scheme, and generally lots of swear words and so on. This pattern has been repeated since, and no doubt took place many times before I came on board. In late June, a guy came on who said he was still shorting the stock and was foolish enough to use his real name. He also foolishly expressed modest support for GSTQ. After getting the famous Stockhouse "treatment," he was never heard from again. Again, this pattern has been repeated in a less-pronounced fashion on Silicon Investor by both yourself, Mr Souami and Mr Lostracco. So the point of the game is, rather than dealing with somebody's point of view or information about KRY-related affairs, find out who he is, find out his "agenda" and thereby get rid of him. In the case of KRY sceptic Felix Freeman of Scotia, it became a concern (perhaps not by you) that he had a South African affiliation with Hugh Leggatt, so there's no point taking what he says seriously. It's a very effective way of shutting out any discussion you don't like. So let's not hear too much from you about the merits of free speech. If you understand the concept, you certainly don't put it into practice. Besides, I've never "blamed" Carson or anyone else for the hype and nonsense. I've merely pointed it out, using their own words. And that includes words of your own (and there is no shortage of them). ----------- On another topic, one point that may be missing about the fact that Crystallex's board of directors lacks a mining professional is that it certainly is reason to pause and consider what are the company's priorities. Lawyers and finance people is what they've got. Well, the company has spoken. As for them being able to hire a miner whenever they feel the need, the question to ask is why this hasn't been done already, considering that they have a working mine that needs to turn a profit and is about to go underground at increased costs. Jerry Collins CSW

To: Avalon who wrote (9572)	8/1/1998 3:41:00 PM
From: Jerry Collins	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 10836

Av -- An example of the hype and nonsense that attracted me to the SH forum in March (the same hype and nonsense that earned Mr Carson such high praise by a majority on the cleansed forum) would be this, from an e-mail of April 26. I think I've run this one before, but it's worth repeating because of the wonderous "insider" quality that Mr Oppenheimer declined to refute. ----------- Carson says Oppenheimer invited to Caracas for "presents" Crystallex International Corporation KRY Shares issued 34,000,000 1998-04-29 close $6.15 Wednesday Apr 29 1998 Roy Carson, writing in his VMI-L Briefing of April 26, says Venezuela's Minister of Energy and Mines, Dr. Erwin Jose Arrieta, contacted Crystallex International president Marc Oppenheimer on April 22 to request a meeting with him in Caracas this week. Mr. Carson writes that the minister told Mr. Oppenheimer he has "presents" that relate to either KRY's Albino mine or, "even more possibly", the gold-rich Las Cristinas 4 & 6 concessions. The transplated Irish journalist, reputed to have high-level contacts both within KRY and Venezuelan officialdom, states: "I have every reason to suppose that Chief Justice Cecilia Sosa Gomez has briefed the President (Rafael Caldera) about the fourth ruling and that he has spoken with Arrieta in private council about it." Mr. Carson, editor of the Internet VENews site, is referring to a pending decision by the Venezuelan supreme court concerning mineral rights at Cristinas. Placer Dome has a work contract at Cristinas, but Crystallex claims title through its local Inversora Mael unit. In an insiderish comment, Mr. Carson describes Mr. Oppenheimer as quietly confident but "bubbling beneath the surface" about the news. (Copyright Canada Stockwatch) Jerry Collins CSW