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Pastimes : Let's Talk About Our Feelings!!! -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Krowbar who wrote (24571)	8/24/1998 1:55:00 AM
From: Dayuhan	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 108807

Del, Thanks. I was beginning to feel like the voice in the wilderness. <<The lies and deception of Reagan on Iran/Contra were far more serious, and went unpunished.>> This is the kind of distinction that I drew badly in the previous post. Iran/Contra was worse because it involved intentional use of executive power to subvert a congressional initiative. In other words, subverting the system of checks and balances that allows government to function. This kind of action is, to me, much more deserving of impeachment or other moves to bring the administration to an immediate halt. The question is not just whether the action is wrong, but whether it threatens the survival of the republic. Impeachment for anything less is frivolous. Steve

To: Krowbar who wrote (24571)	8/24/1998 1:58:00 AM
From: greenspirit	Respond to of 108807

Del, people are in jail for Whitewater, how many people spent time in Jail for Iran Contra after the special prosecutor spent 60 million dollars hmmmmm. Michael

To: Krowbar who wrote (24571)	8/29/1998 1:54:00 PM
From: Grainne	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 108807

Del, I understand your points about the Clinton disaster, but just disagree. As much as his supporters want to say this scandal is just about consensual sex, I don't go along with that interpretation. Interns are sent to businesses and governmental agencies basically in loco parentis--the people for whom they are interning are entrusted with them. Clinton has always had lots of sex outside of his marriage, but this time it is different because he chose a very young woman who was an underling in a power relationship, and committed the offenses while they were both at work. I also think that as the report is released it may become clearer that Clinton has a pattern of abuse of power, perjury, subornation of perjury, and witness intimidation. Kathleen Willey and Linda Tripp were both threatened by Clinton operatives, for example, and Kathleen Willey's cat was killed, her tires were punctured, and her children were threatened as well. Even if you want to totally ignore all of those things, Clinton very deliberately lied to the American people and has put us all through seven months of instability. Key Democrats have stopped supporting him, and a few are calling for him to resign. This is because they no longer trust anything he or his staff members say, and cannot reliably believe that the Starr report doesn't have a lot more damaging detail. I think it is very unfortunate that other Democrats who are running for office will be damaged by Clinton's lack of character--it is not their fault. I am more interested in the continuance of a healthy electoral debate in this country about issues than in propping up one politician who does not deserve my support. I think the sooner he resigns, the better. Incidentally, there were a lot of stories in the news yesterday about how that drug factory in Sudan may well have really been manufacturing pharmaceuticals. I am very troubled that Clinton feels he has the right to just send missiles to kill innocent civilians in other countries without declaring war and getting the approval of Congress. He deliberately subverted that process in a legalistic way, by declaring that the missiles he sent were not retaliatory for the embassy bombings in Africa, although everyone knows they were. And I didn't have all the details when I talked about Monica and the cigar here last week. Apparently Monica had sex with the cigar while he stood there masturbating. One really nice thing about Clinton resigning now is that our children might be spared all the details of this and other unusual sex acts, which will be in Starr's report because Monica testified about them. I am no prude, as you must know, and this sounds like it might be sort of fun between two real adults in a consensual sexual relationship. The president doing it with an intern at work is a different story, however.

To: Krowbar who wrote (24571)	8/29/1998 3:58:00 PM
From: Grainne	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 108807

Del, apparently I still did not have quite the full story on Monica, Bill and the cigar story. Drudge is reporting that the entire incident occurred while Yasser Arafat was waiting outside the room to talk to the president. I know that if I had sex at work I would realize I was taking the risk of being fired. In fact, one of Clinton's sexual traits, discussed at length by women like Gennifer Flowers and Dolly Kyle Browning, is that he is reckless--it excites him to take a lot of chances of being discovered at it. Is Bill's sex life his private affair if he brings it into the workplace? drudgereport.com