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Politics : Bill Clinton Scandal - SANITY CHECK -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Lizzie Tudor who wrote (2488)	9/11/1998 5:19:00 PM
From: Zoltan!	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 67261

Sick is not being charged with adultery. He are the provable charges: The information reveals that President Clinton: lied under oath at a civil deposition while he was a defendant in a sexual harassment lawsuit; lied under oath to a grand jury; attempted to influence the testimony of a potential witness who had direct knowledge of facts that would reveal the falsity of his deposition testimony; attempted to obstruct justice by facilitating a witness's plan to refuse to comply with a subpoena; attempted to obstruct justice by encouraging a witness to file an affidavit that the President knew would be false, and then by making use of that false affidavit at his own deposition; lied to potential grand jury witnesses, knowing that they would repeat those lies before the grand jury; and engaged in a pattern of conduct that was inconsistent with his constitutional duty to faithfully execute the laws. The evidence shows that these acts, and others, were part of a pattern that began as an effort to prevent the disclosure of information about the President's relationship with a former White House intern and employee, Monica S. Lewinsky, and continued as an effort to prevent the information from being disclosed in an ongoing criminal investigation.

To: Lizzie Tudor who wrote (2488)	9/11/1998 5:53:00 PM
From: one_less	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 67261

<<looks like someone is attempting to make sex between 2 willing people look dirty in some way.>> Michelle, You called this a harmless affair between 2 parties. Clinton claims to believe he is responsible for an eternal soul. He has broken a sacred vow to uphold fidelity with Hillary. He did so in a deceitful way. His daughter may be suffering tremendously as a result of his indiscretions. He betrayed family, lied to friends and associates, violated public trust, and maybe committed felonies. I don't think of these characteristics as clean. I haven't heard a single person who criticizes his behavior say they think sex between two parties is dirty. Most of us are on the planet because two people at one time or another thought it was a good thing to do. Why is it you Clinton supporters keep focusing on the sexual issue and accusing those of us who don't approve of lying and abuse, as thinking sex is dirty. The majority of us, like broken records keep repeating, the key issues for us are not his sex life but the deceitful behavior. I am really curious about this. I listen to one radio talk show where the host is supporting Clinton and the whole discussion is around how everyone is unfairly picking on him for having a normal yet momentary inappropriate urge. I listen to another radio talk show where the host apposes Clinton remaining in office and the whole discussion is around lying and trust, not sex being dirty. Of course there are some other conversations where everybody on both sides just likes the juicy gossipy involvement.

To: Lizzie Tudor who wrote (2488)	9/11/1998 6:04:00 PM
From: The Philosopher	Respond to of 67261

Are you forgetting that the man who swore to uphold the Constitution and faithfully execute the laws of the United States has committed multiple felonies? Prostitution is only about sex between two consenting adults -- why don't we accept the defense "it's only sex" in those cases as a full excuse? Or how about a supervisor who has consentual sex with a subordinate? Because it's NOT only about sex. It's about breaking the law in a situation involving sex. Same with BC. If he had only had sex and simply said "sure Monica and I had sex, what of it?" none of this would happen. It's about committing felonies, pure and simple.

To: Lizzie Tudor who wrote (2488)	9/11/1998 6:06:00 PM
From: Thomas G. Busillo	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 67261

Michelle, re: the liberals will see through it immediately It's not "the liberals" who matter. It's not "the conservatives" who matter. You will always have a certain percentage on both ends that will not be swayed no matter how damning or exculpatory the full report proves to be. It's the center, the swing-voters who matter. I am one. He lost me months ago. As far as the "affair" goes - when I have children, I certainly would not want my son to treat a woman that shabbily or have my daughter allow herself to be used in such a manner. While the cigar is shocking (some would say also "aberrant", "depraved", and even possibly "a poor choice, given their proximity to the White House pantry" <g>) what strikes me the most about the allegations in the report isn't the sex itself but the pathological nature of the relationship. If there is such a thing as "a harmless affair" involving married persons (which I've yet to see firsthand), this just isn't the way it's done. There's a real sickness here. Not necessarily the sex, but the level of premeditation, the obsession, the control he is attempting to exert. I'm just an armchair psychologist, but I think it would be interesting to see what a trained, objective observer would conclude about the parties if you could somehow conceal their identities. IMHO, that would be even more damning than the sorrid details of the affair itself. Good trading, Tom

To: Lizzie Tudor who wrote (2488)	9/11/1998 6:06:00 PM
From: Ish	Respond to of 67261

<<Zoltan, now look at what the republicans have done.>> Son of a bitch, the Republicans have learned to play by the same rules as the Democrats. They have become truly disgusting. <<And it looks to me like this was nothing but a harmless affair between 2 parties that was pleasurable for both ->> What about the cigar? Slick put an evil, poisonous thing into her nubile young body. Ask Al Gore about tobacco.

To: Lizzie Tudor who wrote (2488)	9/12/1998 1:33:00 AM
From: wallacestevens	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 67261

True, the Republican party should be ashamed of itself. This is what they have come to, pandering to the wingbat holier-than-thou crowd. Well, they'll never be able to call themselves fiscally conservative again! If everybody in the country who lives in a school district that is falling apart or loaded with "temporary" buildings stops to think how many millions of dollars these perverts (the Starr Troopers) have spent of OUR money on this loathsome witch hunt, there is a strong chance we can restore the House to the Democrats in November.

To: Lizzie Tudor who wrote (2488)	9/12/1998 4:18:00 PM
From: R. Martenson	Respond to of 67261

Being a good Democrat now means you have to stoop to support immorality, perjury ( upity term for lying for the rest of us ), character assassination, and sexual deviation with any suborindate. Great!! If that is what a good Democrat has to do to support the best they can supply to lead the country ...press ahead. You will guarantee a permanent third party revolt in this country. Go forward in the next political debate on the platform of Larry Flynt and John Gottie versus the boring Jimmy Carter and Humbert Humphrey. Maybe the Democrats can generate a candidate that has learned both from Clinton and Nixon and really knock the socks off morality and integrity in this country. We now ( or have known ) this guy lies, cheats, and beguils beyond the pale. And unless you have been living in a closet for the last 6 years, the exact same tactics are used for policy decisions and historical manipulation. When the next shoe drops (again), who will have any credibility left to be the spin machine on CNN. The Democratic party use to have some integrity and respect, I seriously think those who have to think more than a minute about dropping Clinton as a national symbol of leadership and pride are not thinking beyond the last spin from the White House. Isuggest you not try to win the battle and lose the war. The national honor is far more important than the sanctimonious pride of a liar supported by misguided voters. The report was excessive, but with the master spin machine in place is there ANY thing the Clintons can do that can't be explained, leaked, nullified, or obscured beyond reasonable logic. Anyone remember what John Dillinger was finally convicted of? Anyone remember how many times it took to get John Gottie??