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Pastimes : Religion on SI -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Chris land who wrote (1074)	9/17/1998 1:22:00 PM
From: Raymond James Norris	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 1542

Moses never used the title and never claimed to. He says the exact same thing God does in Exodus 3:4. If his saying it is subject to challenge in Exodus 3:4, it it also subject to challenge in John 8:58, unless you only apply it to Jesus (Pbuh). Jesus did not need to quote anyone, he spoke for himself. Since he was God in the flesh he already had that authority invested within. It's not possible to use as proof the question we are trying to determine. If we're trying to determine whether Jesus (Pbuh) claimed unqualified divinity in John 8:58, you can't point out that since he was God, he could make those statements. It's circular logic. Are you, as a Muslim really qualified to speak for all of the Greek Christians? No I'm not. I'm just telling you Greek Christians don't believe Jesus (Pbuh) quoted God in John 8:58 because in the greek language what Jesus (Pbuh) and God said are totally different. English speaking people using English translated Bibles though will believe it because of the manipulation by the translators (as we proved earlier with their application of the word "savior" only to Jesus (Pbuh) and God even though it was applied to many others). I didn't know you believed in the Old Testament. We believe in the message sent to Moses (Pbuh), but don't believe the current OT is that same message. I'm using the Old Testament to exhibit the inconsistency with Christian interpretation and the translators' manipulation. However I can assure you that nobody lived with God before they were born. Jeremiah 1:5 "Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart; I appointed you as a prophet to the nations." God knew Jeremiah before he was formed in his mother's womb. But let me ask you, was Mohammed ever known to speak to his servants out of heaven? ? Did Mohammed ever bring one of his servants into heaven? Muslims don't hold Muhammad (Pbuh) as being anything more than a servant and messenger of God. He was not divine. He was human, just like us. We don't believe he was the son of God or begotten. He is a slave of God, as we all are. Peace be unto you, Norris