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To: ToySoldier who wrote (3840)	9/16/1998 11:32:00 AM
From: Don Hurst	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 8218

Toy and ttf, I have been enjoying your debates and after being out of the business for the last 6 years (I was always a mainframe bigot; today I would be an "enterprise server" bigot) I still kind of pride myself on being up with the tech buzzwords. Now don't destroy my ego completely but what is CORBA? Regards, Don

To: ToySoldier who wrote (3840)	9/17/1998 2:50:00 PM
From: David Harker	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 8218

ToySoldier, in your post to TreeTop, you wrote: >If IBM isnt in the game to EVOLVE their customers and the industry >to Java / CORBA, then they wont be successful. IBM is in that game, via the project I'm working on, the San Francisco Project. Please examine the web site for this project, look at the statements from various independent consultants, comments from CEO's of various software companies we are teaming-up with, etc. "San Francisco" was the internal code name (S = Sharable, F = Frameworks) and it kind of 'stuck'... ibm.com Also, read the following 3 links (accessible from the link above): from DBMS magazine: "IBM: More Than a Hill o' Beans - Directing the future of e-business, the San Francisco Project, and ... Java?" dbmsmag.com which says, in part: "But IBM as a hardware supplier has also worked extensively in making these various Web-oriented programs operate across its platforms. While this in itself was not surprising (IBM's motherlode has always been legacy systems), I was surprised at how far IBM had already gone in implementing Java as the common language. I was also surprised by some of the initiatives IBM had taken on its own to enhance the effectiveness of the Java language, in particular with its San Francisco project. ... "Reusable application frameworks are exactly what IBM's San Francisco project is all about. Developers build applications by modifying and extending the default business objects and logic of the framework rather than starting an application from the raw requirements and application analysis. A specific example is the Purchase Order Management framework that contains code, logic, and default properties for managing sales orders, quotes, and supply contracts throughout their life cycles. Perhaps a question has popped into your head about the name, "San Francisco project." What is this, a product or product line? Why "project"? It's a project because it's a collaborative effort. The impetus for the application frameworks came from some of IBM's software partners, primarily application builders in and around large corporations. They wanted to leverage object-oriented technology but were hindered by the high cost of developing components, the need to retrain programmers, and the potential risks of investing in a new technology." ... "I believe that IBM, not Sun, is the barometer for the success of Java. IBM has wagered that Java will be the common language that binds and integrates its many pieces. This role is even more important than Cobol, which was the soul of IBM applications, but not the heart of its systems operation. Java has the potential to be both. Java must succeed because there is so much at stake for IBM (and by extension, Lotus). If Sun can't do it, then IBM will pick up the reins." "IBM San Francisco Project Growing in Importance at IBM" news400.com from TechWeb: "IBM: I Left My Java In San Francisco" techweb.com which says, in part: "San Francisco is in its second release now, version 1.2, and checks in at a formidable 500,000 lines of code. It is structured to provide core Java building blocks, encapsulating business process logic for applications including general ledger, warehouse management, order management, and accounts receivable/accounts payable." and "IBM now has more than 360 ISV licensees of San Francisco and said it expects to have roughly 100 products shipping by year's end based on San Francisco code."

To: ToySoldier who wrote (3840)	9/17/1998 3:14:00 PM
From: David Harker	Respond to of 8218

more Info on San Francisco Project: from CNet: news.com "IBM and the Chinese Ministry of Information Industry (MII) have announced agreements under which IBM will work with the ministry and with Chinese independent software vendors on the development of Java-based business applications. IBM and its Chinese partners will jointly develop Chinese language versions of JavaOS for Business, Lotus Notes/Domino, VisualAge for Java, eSuite, and IBM San Francisco business application components. American technology providers including IBM are no strangers to the Chinese market, but IBM said it will differentiate itself in these agreements with its commitment to open, nonproprietary standards. IBM's program director for Java marketing, David Gee, explicitly contrasted this approach to that of Microsoft." from InfoWorld: infoworld.com "IBM announces sweeping Java tide By Niall McKay InfoWorld Electric Posted at 7:57 AM PT, Mar 24, 1998 SAN FRANCISCO -- IBM announced at the JavaOne conference here Monday that it will standardize its programming model for its middleware and mainframe software on Sun's Enterprise JavaBean (EJB) standard. As first reported by InfoWorld (see IBM scales up Java plans), the company will morph its San Francisco project into EJB and will use the standard to unite its disparate software architectures and products, including the San Francisco project's business application frameworks, Visual Age for Java development environment, Component Broker and Transarc TXSeries middleware, and Servlet Express." ... "The company (IBM) also has been responsible for a lot of the specifications in Sun's EJB specification, Sueltz said. Java Transaction Server is an implementation of the CORBA-based Object Transaction Service. The Java Messaging Service is based on the IBM MQ Series Messaging API. EJB's Session and Entity Beans are based on Session and Entity services in IBM's San Francisco Framework, and the company worked closely with Novell on the Java Naming and Directory Interface. " From TechWeb: techweb.com "Of course, for Java to live up to its promise, it has to be useful for mission-critical applications. That's why so many eyes are on IBM Corp.'s San Francisco Project (SFP) enterprise Java framework. Critics point out that only a single application-IBM's own general ledger-has been delivered, but Joe Damassa, director of marketing for SFP, counsels patience. "Java has grown up with a fast-food mentality, but we're talking about applications such as payroll and logistics that typically take 18 months to two years to develop." Right, but wasn't SFP designed specifically to shorten those cycles? According to Damassa, that benefit doesn't kick in until you work on your second application. "This is a complicated framework, and it takes time to learn." Steven Fraleigh, a technical architect with Camelot-IS2 International Inc., Cambridge, Mass., believes SFP will help his company with time to market. "It puts in all the transactional and other middleware, which means we don't have to build it ourselves." List of Software firms who are Partners with IBM in San Fran: ibm.com