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Pastimes : Let's Talk About Our Feelings!!! -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: George S. Montgomery who wrote (25080)9/28/1998 7:46:00 PM
From: Jacques Chitte  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 108807
 
Ow. My head hurts. You made me think.

>Isn't there possibly an underlying base of awareness - that, even if we are
ferns, places us more or less in line with existence?<

You mean, simply by being? Maybe. But just being, unless you have a stomach for abject poverty on par with a mendicant Buddhist, is a pretty lousy place to be. Imho. And when you die, all that's left is a patch of slightly greener daisies.

I biased my argument to the modern cash-dependent mode of existence. Absent a successful Welfare State wherein the correlation between hard work and a full stomach is entirely erased, I think there is an underlying theme of reward for achievement. It is necessarily not compassionate. There will be pain. But I do believe that the human animal is most amazingly motivated by avoiding pain. In our world (ignoring boundary conditions like marrying or inheriting money) the most direct way to gain some security is to earn more than you need - and spend less than you earn. My emphasis on facts, recall and all the other measures of performance serves as a reminder. Let's never forget - these are the surest ways to secure continuity of existence. Once I'm reassured my children have grasped that work (and more specifically, achievement. What is more heartbreaking than effort which does not achieve?) is the mainspring of security - I will indulge their aesthetic quests.
I don't deride the poet. But if there is enough food for one, and there is a poet and a farmer - the poet starves. Having poets is a badge of a society's prosperity. They are an effect, not a cause.
***jmho***

I wonder if I answered your question.



To: George S. Montgomery who wrote (25080)9/28/1998 8:36:00 PM
From: Dayuhan  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 108807
 
George,

<<Isn't there possibly an underlying base of awareness - that, even if we are ferns, places us more or less in line with existence?>>

Yes, absolutely. But the discussion started with the question of educational priorities: should schools teach children facts or teach them to develop ideas. Alex preferred facts, as do I, for two reasons, first because it's pretty well impossible to develop ideas without a reasonable command of factual material, and second because "teaching children to develop ideas" is something it's easy to say you're doing even when you aren't. The cop-out potential is huge.

The underlying base of awareness you speak of is real, and deserves respect, but I don't see it as something you learn in school.

Steve