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To: Susan Saline who wrote (17581)	11/30/1998 6:17:00 PM
From: AnnaInVA	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 53068

Sue, I placed a sell order at market to get out of NAVR at $26. By the time Brown & Co got to me, I got $17. Oh well, still up 8, but not what I wanted ;)

To: Susan Saline who wrote (17581)	11/30/1998 6:21:00 PM
From: Iceberg	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 53068

>no MM's going to screw around with me any more Sue, Stick to the NYSE. Why even trade at all on the putrid, crooked, corrupt NASDAQ? It's a scam operation,IMO. Ice

To: Susan Saline who wrote (17581)	11/30/1998 9:08:00 PM
From: tom pope	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 53068

Sue, given the type of trading that you do, why don't you go to a real real-time system like Realtick (too many "reals" in that sentence, sorry), such as MBT or ABWatley provide. You know at all times what your position is and whether you've been filled - you can see your bid or offer on the screen if you're at the inside bid or offer. With MBT the system would probably be free at your level of transactions per month.

To: Susan Saline who wrote (17581)	11/30/1998 11:13:00 PM
From: DanZ	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 53068

Market Makers. Sue, With regard to your comment... <I'll stick with the "name" brands ... like SEEK from now on...both my SEEK sell and buy at eod were confirmed within seconds...no MM's going to screw around with me any more.> I placed an order this morning to buy 1,000 shares of VLSI at 11 5/8 when the spread was 11 1/2 x 11 5/8. There was plenty of size to fill my order but I didn't get a confirmation back. The stock stayed at 11 1/2 x 11 5/8 to 11 9/16 x 11 5/8 for a while so I wasn't overly concerned about not getting the confirmation back because it wasn't moving very fast. After 45 minutes and still no confirm, the stock moved down to 11 7/16 x 11 1/2 so I called Ameritrade and was greeted with a message that said the hold time would be 7 minutes. Clunk went the phone and I placed a cancel replace to buy the stock at 11 1/2. Guess what? Within seconds I got a confirmation back that I bought the stock at 11 9/16. Hmmm, you think the market maker was playing a game with me. I called his bluff by sending the cancel replace. Later in the day, VLSI was at 11 7/16 x 11 1/2 and I placed an order to buy another 1,500 shares at 11 1/2. Again, 30 minutes went by without a confirmation. I called Ameritrade and this time waited on hold for 15 minutes before they answered my call. The broker who answered said the market makers were very slow sending back fill reports because of the volume. I told him that VLSI had only traded 500,000 shares for the day and that is light volume for it. He said there was nothing they could do; it was the market makers taking a long time to send back fill reports. So I hung up and called his bluff again, placing a cancel replace to buy the stock at 11 7/16 (the then current offer). Within seconds I received a confirmation that my order had been filled at 11 1/2. I'd be willing to bet that the market makers are purposely delaying fill reports for some reason. How long does it take to send back a report? The only reasons I can think of that they would do such a thing is to cut down on day trading or to screw you on the price by waiting to see which way the stock moves before giving you a fill. I can't prove that and it's really counter productive to cut down on day trading since market makers want more volume. Maybe it was just a coincidence that I was able to get a fast confirm twice by placing cancel replace orders. The moral of the story is that VLSI is a "name brand" stock and I had the same problem as you. My trades today on RL, PBY, and TOY were executed and confirmed within seconds. It could be that a different market maker handled my order. I asked Ameritrade if they would tell me who handled my VLSI order but they wouldn't tell me. I think it was NITE but I'm not sure who handled my RL, PBY, and TOY orders. To Ice: I disagree that the Nasdaq is a scam operation. The new rules that were recently put in place level the playing field tremendously. Not only that, but many brokers use market makers for NYSE stocks. Ameritrade doesn't place any orders to NYSE specialists. All orders go to market makers regardless of the exchange. What that means is it makes no difference what exchange a stock is traded on; many discount brokers don't send orders to the NYSE, even for NYSE stocks. The S&P 500 futures closed at a discount to cash of 1.20 points and they are down another 3.80 points right now. If things stay like they are, it doesn't look like tomorrow's open will be very good. Still, it's not a good idea to fight fed easing and I think this correction will run it's course rather quickly.