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Pastimes : Ask God -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Jamey who wrote (23061)	12/5/1998 1:10:00 AM
From: PROLIFE	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 39621

Tradition holds that Peter died as a martyr in Rome in the 60s (1 Clem. 5:1-6:1). The First Epistle of Clement to the Corinthians ( The Salutation) The Church of God which resides at Rome, to the Church of God residing at Corinth, to them that are called and sanctified by the will of God, through our Lord Jesus Christ: Grace and peace from Almighty God through Jesus Christ be multiplied unto you. What are you thinking? (In the body of the letter).. But let us not dwell only upon ancient examples. Let us come to the most recent spiritual heroes. Let us take the noble examples furnished in our own generation. Through envy and jealousy the greatest and most righteous pillars [of the Church] have been persecuted and put to death. Let us set before our eyes the illustrious apostles. Peter, through unrighteous envy, endured not one or two, but numerous labors. When he had at length suffered martyrdom, he departed to the place of glory due to him. Because of envy, Paul also obtained the reward of patient endurance, after being seven times thrown into captivity, compelled to flee and stoned. After preaching both in the East and West, he gained the illustrious reputation due to his faith, having taught righteousness to the whole world. When he came to the extreme limit of the West, he suffered martyrdom under the prefects. Thus was he removed from the world and went into the holy place, having proved himself a striking example of patience. The end of Peters letter(1 Peter) says this: 12 With the help of Silas, whom I regard as a faithful brother, I have written to you briefly, encouraging you and testifying that this is the true grace of God. Stand fast in it. 13 She who is in Babylon, chosen together with you, sends you her greetings, and so does my son Mark. 14 Greet one another with a kiss of love. Peace to all of you who are in Christ. I take it here Babylon is Rome. So I guess he was in Rome, now about being claimed by the Catholic Church I could not tell you as i do not know much about the Catholic Denomination. But I personally believe that Peter was an Apostle with power, and that he was considered an Elder of the church and outside of that he needed no other moniker, but that is my opinion. Again whether he "started" the catholic religion I don't have a clue as I have not studied it that close. dan

To: Jamey who wrote (23061)	12/5/1998 5:15:00 AM
From: John S.	Respond to of 39621

Hello Santiago, Jumping in if I may. Catholicism can make all the claims they want but will not get scripture to support their ideas concerning Peter. Rather than offer my opinion I'll just use scripture verses. Catholicism says Peter was the rock and Christ was not referring to Himself as the rock. They also say Peter was essentially the first Pope. The bible says... I Corinthians 10:4 "And did all drink the same spiritual drink: for they drank of that spiritual Rock that followed them: and that Rock was Christ. Psalm 18:31 "For who is God save the Lord? or who is a rock save our God?" Deut. 32:3-4 "Because I will publish the name of the Lord: ascribe ye greatness unto our God. He is the Rock, his work is perfect..." There are more verses yet. As far as apostolic assention which Catholicism claims is the lineage of the Popes who cannot be married ever according to their doctrine. Peter was married.... Mat. 8:14 "And when Jesus was come into Peter's house, he saw his wife's mother laid, and sick of a fever. I may stand corrected but I do not believe there is anything historical supporting Peter being in Rome nor scripture supporting that either. Paul yes, Peter no. False claims of Peter starting the R.C. religion. Check out Constantine baptizing his legions as "christians" I'll try and dig up the information on that one. My readings have indicated that as a much closer beginning to the blending of Pagan Romanism and Christianity producing Catholicism. That aside how goes the battle? Your too quiet on this thread lately. Stir something up or maybe you just did :0) God bless my friend, John

To: Jamey who wrote (23061)	12/5/1998 8:29:00 AM
From: Sam Ferguson	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 39621

Santiago Peter was historicized and never lived, but you need to read outside the bible to get the full story of formation of the Roman Catholic church and the reasons why. When Rome came to power the pharisees were rebelling protesting the inhumane act of slavery. There were so many uprisings they created the new religion after Paul's death and made his writing a part of their newly created scriptures and appointed the high priest giving Sadducees power over the pharisees. All this was done by obliterating all contrary documents, rewriting the bible. establishing the church as a state religion and killing anyone who didn't go along with it. As you know the Christian religion of the time was accepted by only those in the Land controlled by the Roman empire. As they say, truth is stranger than fiction, and I know unless you bother to verify the above thru historical records you will just LOL and think I'm a kook. There is no need to bother reading the bible for proof. That is just circular reasoning which hasn't found agreement in over 1800 years of study. Eastern religions think Christianity is a joke.