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To: PAL who wrote (87434)12/31/1998 12:20:00 PM
From: Don Martini  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 176387
 
**OT***Hello, PAL! Is Jesus the Son of god or God the Son? Jesuit Priest McKenzie writes in his fine Dictionary of the Bible:

"TRINITY. The trinity of God is defined by the Church as the belief that in God are 3 persons who subsist in one nature. The belief as so defined was reached only in the 4th & 5th centuries AD and hence is not explicitly and formally a Biblical belief ... in Catholic belief the trinity is a mystery which ultimately escapes understanding. ... The Old Testament does not contain suggestions or foreshadowing of the trinity of persons."

Christianity is an extension of Judaism. All Bible writers were Hebrews, as is our Messiah. McKenzie tells us that Jehovah concealed His true identity from His people for 45 centuries until the RCC defined it. Consider the Shema, the great Hebrew prayer in Deuteronomy 6, [Divine Name restored] Hear, O Israel: Jehovah our God is one Jehovah

In Daniel 7:13 is a prophecy of Jesus' return to heaven after his work on Earth: One like the Son of man came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him. Angels (verse 10) bring the Son to Jehovah. If Jesus were God would he need an angelic escort to bring himself to meet Himself? This term son of man is applied to Jesus 77 times in the New Testament. Could Jehovah be the Son of man?

Never is Jesus called God the Son, always the Son of God:
Satan: If you are a son of God Matthew 4:3,6 & Luke 4:3&9
Demons: What have we to do with you, Son of God Mark 8:29, 5:7, 3:11
Jesus: I am God's Son John 10:36, 11:4, 17:1
JEHOVAH: You are my son Psalm 2:8, Matt 2:15, 3:17, 17:5
Angel: Son of the Most High Mark 1:32,35
Officer: Certainly this man was God's SonMark 15:39

Does God have a God? Jesus does: Revelation 3:12, 2 Cor 1:3, Eph 1:3
and John 20:17: I am ascending to my God and your God

So what about John 1:1? Mckenzie says, page 317 under GOD:
"Jn 1:1 should rigorously be translated: The word was with the God [= the Father], and the word was a divine being."

Moses was right: there is only One Jehovah. Jesus is his Son.
I appreciate your interest in Y2K and the second coming, PAL. Will PM you about this. Thank you for your generous compliments for our brotherhood. By this all will know you are my disciples, that you have love among yourselves.

My very best regards to you, PAL.

Don Martini



To: PAL who wrote (87434)12/31/1998 3:59:00 PM
From: On the QT  Read Replies (2) | Respond to of 176387
 
OT-OT

Hi Paul,

Normally, I would not discuss this matter on this thread, however because of late, we have heard from more than one, given the season and I believe the friendship developed by most in our Dell family, I feel somewhat motivated to share some thoughts with you and others.

I was born and still consider myself to be of the Roman Catholic faith. Although, I wonder if, those of us that represent, the Hierarchical Church would be as generous in defining my belief system.

For many years, I sought in religion, reason and logic, in a world where man's inhumanity to man crashed upon my senses, like a boy whose lost his footing, falling from a high place in a whirling nonsense of babbling and haranguing in pain I often howled: How could it be that a just loving and omnipotent God would permit all that I perceived to be at odds with that which I was taught to believe and completely at odds with my sense of what should be?

Feeling jumbled and confused, I sought solace in the wisdom of the ages and in those who seemed to have a knowing about things of which I know little. This was and continues to be a lifelong journey.

Don Martini has graciously sent information to me ( thank you Don once again for your most recent generosity, may Jehovah's blessing be on us all).I continue to read from a number of bibles especially of late, the New Testament from the King James version sent to me by a dear Born Again relative, whose beliefs and personage I hold in great esteem ( for it is for me, Jesus Christ who personally calls me to "Be for others as I am for you") and from Holy Bible American Standard Version recently sent to me by Don along with many other valued books and information.

Don recently sent me a book called "Mankind's Search for God" which is published by The Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society of New York, Inc. which gives a well written and clear explanation of the major religions of the world. My attraction to Judaism, Hinduism, Islam is very much a source of wisdom excitement and joy.

There is much to learn and experience. For me it is all about learning ,loving and expressing that learning and love.

You seem to me, in reviewing some of your recent posts a very thoughtful, caring and friendly person. You pose an interesting question, much like the one I had. There is much not understood and much to learn. Perhaps for me I always will be dealing with an imperfect set of information, interpretation and implementation.

This quote from the New Testament taken from the Revised Standard Version is most indicative of what I have come to call my "knowing":

"Now there are varieties of gifts, but the same Spirit; and there are varieties of service, but the same Lord; and there varieties of working, but it is the same God who inspires them all in every one. To each is given the manifestation of the Spirit for the common good."

1 Corinthians 12.4-7.

My best wishes to you and yours, and to each one of us in our Dell family, the best of what was and what is to come.

Regards,
QT