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Pastimes : Kosovo -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: Yaacov who wrote (5318)4/24/1999 3:35:00 PM
From: goldsnow  Respond to of 17770
 
You are indeed very ignorant of what is taking place in Europe! Serbs
killed 200,000 Bosnians, 100,000 military age Kosovars are missing, all the misery that this
man has cuased, and you say 42 sites only??>>>

Yacoov, I am sure that you are trying to simplify the Balkan problem intentionally to highlght your nobel attempts to prevent minimising of human tragedy by opponents of this war, myself including...
....However, George made his point repeatedly that scale of present suffering since ill-conceived bomb campaign eclipsed even most pessimistic assertions and worse as I am sure you would concede to come...
Some compare future of Kosovo to Germany where US troops had to stay for over 50 years...it is nonsense Germany wanted troops, Kosovo will be klling ground long after Milosevic is gone...The worst outcome would be "victory"...the greater the "victory" would be the greater tragedy and suffering would come




To: Yaacov who wrote (5318)4/24/1999 4:15:00 PM
From: George Papadopoulos  Read Replies (2) | Respond to of 17770
 
> Shame on George, your living in a free country, enjoying your rights
as a citizen, and you are whitewashing the crimes against humanity.Yaacov,

Shame on you for supporting bombs on TV stations, schools, civilian trains, bridges, water plants and on and on...

> Are you blind, do you think the entire European press is lying about
what is happening in Kosovo? Do you call this tabloid journalism?

My friend I believe you are the one who is blind...Too bad you can't see it.

> Again you are day dreaming! Milosvoic's goverenment was about to fall last year,
so he started the Kosovo conflict to draw the Serbs attention away form internal
problem to Kosovo and that we remain
in power! This has been his trick in the past 10 years! Frist Slovenia, where 5000
Slovenian troops kicked the entire Serb army out!
Then Croatia and Bsonia. Now in Kosovo. After he has lost Kosovo,
he will try Vojovdina! He has to keep the Serbs in the state of siege
so he can remain in power!

Are you in contact with James Shea or what? You forgot to say that he is evil? Let me ask you something Mr. Humanitarian Bomber? Would you have signed that scam Rauimbullet piece of crap that was "negotiated"?

> 100,000 military age Kosovars are missing, all the misery
that this man has cuased, and you say 42 sites only??
You call these alegations?

Sure...If you believe this crap what can I say? False allegations...42 sites!!!!LOL

>You should start readind serious news paprer, reading Donald Dock,
Superman, Delon Dog. and Sunday New YOurk Times with 50 inserts about JC Pennies, and Eckard Drugs is no way to know what is taking place in the world!

The same goes for you...What I read I have tried to place a link here so the ignorant masses can be educated...or at least get another perspective than the official Nato propaganda.

>You and your Serbian brothers are fighting the same war, Greeks agaisnt the
conquering Ottomans! George, you can't go and kill Alabians because the formed
the bulk of Ottman Armies that conquered
"Constaninapoli" 600 years ago. The problem is that you hate Albanians because
they are Moslem and close to Turks! You have the inferiority complex that makes
you hate all Moslems. They can't help themselves, same as you can't help yourself
being a Greek!

The only war I am seeing is ball less leaders folowing blindly Clinton and Blair criminally attacking a sovereign country for trying to solve an internatl terrorist movement. As far as Greeks fighting haven't seen much of that lately...But if Greece is attacked you better be damn sure that we will defend our country with our blood. As far as hating Moslems etc...Excuse me but I am an atheist...I hate all religions equally<g>, especially when they try to force them on me.

> And know that I am not worried if Albanians move next door to me! I have nothing against them!

Sure...just like Nato says we are bombing you but we got nothing against you ....

Get a grip



To: Yaacov who wrote (5318)4/25/1999 11:54:00 AM
From: goldsnow  Respond to of 17770
 
A whole-page paid announcement on page 4 of German daily „Frankfurter
Rundschau" of April 23, 1999

(found bev Searle Senett-GPM thread)
------------------------------------------------------------------------

Open Letter to the Ministers Fischer and Scharping

Against a new kind of Auschwitz-Lie

Holocaust survivors condemn the statements of the Federal Government on the parallels
Auschwitz-Kosovo

The Auschwitz survivors Esther Bejarano, Kurt Goldstein and the Federal spokesman
of VVN-BdA Peter Gingold, who is also a member of Auschwitz Comitee, together
with other Jewish survivors of holocaust turned themselves against those who think that
the postulate „Never more war" should be abandoned in favour of the mandate „Never
more Auschwitz". The undersigners, who lost numerous family members in Auschwitz,
rejected the statements to this effect made by the Foreign Minister Joseph Fischer and
the Minister of Defense Rudolph Scharping. They wrote the following letter to the
Ministers:

Very respected Mr. Foreign Minister!

The Defense Minister has, already before the illegitimate NATO agression against
Yugoslavia, in which the Federal Armed Forces, Bundeswehr, participate in an
anti-constitutional way, on the occasion of a visit of German Army to Auschwitz, said
that „the Federal Armed Forces are in Bosnia" in order to prevent a new Auschwitz and
that it therefore „may as well go into Kosovo". In his lack of arguments, the Foreign
Minister too invoked a new kind of Auschwitz-Lie in order to justify the fatal violation of
the UN Charter, which was made precisely on the basis of the lessons drawn from the
fascist war and holocaust.

We, the survivors of Auschwitz and other mass destruction camps, condemn the abuse
of the deads of Auschwitz, of the genocide against the Jews, Sinti and Roma, and Slavs,
organized and perpetrated by Hitler's fascists in the name of German superior race, that
you and other politicians are abusing. What you're doing is a kind of down-playing of a
crime unique in the history of humanity because you lack arguments for your fatal policy.
This action of yours is obviously supposed to justify a heavy and inexcusable violation of
the Charter of United Nations. The victor countries against Germany and Japan have
bestowed upon themselves this Charter in 1945 in order „to protect the future
generations from the scourge of war, which has brought unspeakable sorrow to the
humanity in our own life time" and they arose from the German soil, as we all know.
They have pledged to „join ranks in order to safeguard the World Piece and
International Security".

The World Piece and International Security are now in danger, because a war is being
fougt from German soil against a founding member of UNO, a war against a country,
which suffered greatest sacrifices in the fight against Hitler and rendered an invaluable
service for the liberation of Europe against fascism. To invoke Auschwitz as justification
for such a war is infamous.

The actions of Yugoslav leadership against the Albanian minority violate human rights.
We condemn it. We condemn it in the same way as we have condemned the actions of
Turkish government against the Kurds and the actions of Israeli leadership against the
Palestinians. We have always demanded - and we demand it even now - that such
actions should be dealt with within the means at the disposal of UNO. He who does not
use the anti-fascist role and human-rights dedication of UNO, who neglects and
weakens the UNO, loses the right to reference the anti-fascist postulates like „Never
more Auschwitz", especially since at the same time he establishes a right to war. The
consequences of such actions will be an awakening of those forces which appeared to
have been decisively defeated.

Very respected Mrs. Ministers!

In view of your utterances and political practices we are asking you:

Should it be forgotten, that in this century Serbia was twice visited by destruction and
devastation from German soil? Should the massacre of a million Serbs be forgotten,
which was perpetrated by German nazis and their domestic and foreign executioners in
the World War II? Measured on the total populations, the Serbian Slavs are the largest
victims, second only to Jews.

Should it be forgotten that the destruction of Serbia between 1914 and
1918 was entrusted to that army commander and hussar with death's head
insignia, August von Mackensen, who, in 1915 and time and again afterwards, ordered
„ruthless treatment" of the Serbian population, and who then helped Hitler as
propagandist to the last - up to the call to sacrifice the youth as people's storm, and after
whom a caserne of Federal Armed Forces is still named in Hildesheim?

Should it be forgotten that it is not only the royal military, the
Reichswehr, and the [nazi military] Wehrmacht, who had experienced
Serb-killers in their ranks, but the [modern] Bundeswehr too? We refer
to the Colonel of Wehrmacht Karl-Wilhelm Thilo, who became the highest
ranking General and Commander of the 1st Alpine Division - the very same division,
which is now waving the German flag on the Balkans - he was even Deputy Inspector of
the Army. He signed orders for massacres
against the Yugoslavs, and contributed his writings to the books that
made the rounds in Federal Armed Forces praising the genocide, according to H. Lanz
(Ed.) „Alpine Riflemen - The 1st Alpine Division 1935/1945".

Should it be forgotten that the war of the Federal Armed Forces against Serbia violates
the International Law unequivocally, not only the UN Charter, but also the NATO Pact,
the Final Act of Helsinki, the
Constitution and the 2-plus-4 Agreement? The Germany has repeatedly
pledged to respect the UN Charter and now tramples upon it with the
attack on Yugoslavia. The Federal Armed Forces violated the injunctions dictated by
the political environment. „In addition the Federal Government has confirmed the
injunction not to start an aggression war". (from the 2-plus-4 Agreement of September
12, 1990, quoted after the „White Book 1994" of the Federal Army).

Should it be forgotten that by means of this war Yugoslavia is to be
forced to sign an Agreement, which can only be compared with the Munich Dictate of
1938, with which Czechoslowakian Republic was destroyed, just like today Yugoslavia
is to be destroyed? „An Agreement is null and void, if its conclusion was reached under
threat or application of force in contravention to the principles of International Law as
laid down in the Charter of United Nations." This is written in the Vienna Convention on
the Treaties Law, Article 52.

We demand firmly: Stop the war against Jugoslavia, and as immediate
step: Stop the bombings. Negotiations instead of shootings. We demand
the restoration of UN Charter and strengthening of UNO. This as a
contribution to the realization and defense of anti-fascist achievements of the peoples of
the world.

Highly respectfully

Esther Bejarano, Hamburg Hand Frankenthal, Dortmund
Peter Gingold, Frankfurt am Main Ruddi Lippmann, Berlin
Kurt Goldstein, Berlin Erhard Deutsch, Berlin
Walter Bloch, Duesseldorf Vera Mitteldorf, Berlin
Henny Dreifuss, Duesseldorf Werner Krich, Berlin
Guenter Haensel, Neuss Irmgard Konrad, Berlin
Werner Stertzenbach, Duesseldorf Maricha & Adi Koenig, Berlin
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Questions and additional signatures: Peter Gingold, Reichstorfststrasse
3, 60528 Frankfurt am Main, Phone & Fax: (+49)69/672-631; as well as
Ulrich Sander, c/o VVN-BdA, Gathe 55, 421007 Wuppertal, Phone & Fax:
(+49)202/450-629
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Contributions towards the financing of this Advertisement, which was
made possible by a friendly circle should please be transferred to this
account: Peter Gingold, Account No. 440-477, Frankfurter Sparkasse, BLZ
500 502 01, Purpose „Letter to the Ministers"
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
ViSdP: Peter Gingold, Reichstorfstrasse 3, 60528 Frankfurt am Main