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To: Stormweaver who wrote (5766)	4/28/1999 6:20:00 PM
From: Jacalyn Deaner	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 17770

James Nicoll - I DISAGREE. The preoccupation lies with this socialist fascist administration; their agenda attaches itself opportunistically to any tragedy played out in the press. If you disarm the people, who will protect the people from a corrupt government. If a government has nothing to be afraid of, there would be no preoccupation with the removal of arms from the people. It is not the guns that are the problem - it is the lack of moral leadership; the government has passed laws and regulations that regulate the manner in which a parent can raise a chile; having taken the discipline away from the parent, the child is given rights and ameneties that are above it's comprehension and standing. The parent has its hands tied. The child has the rights of adults, but pays no consequences for adult behavior nor actions. NO CONSEQUENCES - DOUBLE STANDARDS... The leadership in this country - behaves with lack of moral and ethical standards - no consequences for illegal behavior. How does a country expect its children to behave when the leadership itself is hypocratic. The leadership has intentionally instituted CHAOS - in that CHAOS - the people unwittingly feel the need to turn over their rights to a hedonistic, corrupt government. The next thing you are going to have to control is COMMERCE down to the DETAIL - a required listing of all groceries you purchae will automatically be turned over via email to a branch of the government to make sure you are not purchasing any ingredients to make bombs. This administration loves dealing with this myopic nation of idiots. Over the past 8 years, your rights and freedoms have diminished by HALF; and the people cry out for the government to take more. James, what ever are we going to do about the societal preoccupation with nihilism? Jacalyn

To: Stormweaver who wrote (5766)	4/28/1999 7:13:00 PM
From: D. Long	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 17770

<<I think that those numbers indicate a societal pre-occupation with guns. Based on littleton and the volume of murders in U.S. cities committed with hand guns this suggest greater regulation and control is required.>> How many of those guns are hunting weapons? Hunters dont just have one gun. I myself have 5, including one handgun. My father owns another three. Most hunters have a comparable collection. So the figure may be deceptive. I would honestly like to see any demographic breakdown of those numbers. As to the great mass of gun related deaths in this country, the emphasis on gun deaths is widely exaggerated. More people die from automobile accidents and accidental drowning than from gunshot wounds every year. The fact remains that gun related violence is a symptom, not a cause, of violence. Regulating guns will not, and hasnt, worked because it is not the cause of the problem. There are already books full of firearms regulations in this country. More regulations will not solve the underlying social and economic causes of violence. It is easy to point the finger at guns, it is far harder to look at the real causes of violence, and even harder to formulate solutions. It is a cop out. But in any case, I dont want to turn this thread into the "Gun thread," though Im afraid Ive done much to do this unintentionally. My apologies to everyone I have not replied to, especially Neocon and Gustave. I am terribly busy and unfortunately I have chosen to "pick my posts" so to speak. ;) Perhaps all those interested can join an already in-progress discussion I found here on SI today, aptly called Second Amendment. For now I have to limit my time to discussion. :)