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To: kash johal who wrote (81371)	5/23/1999 3:39:00 PM
From: Paul Engel	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 186894

Kash - Re: "Also the RAS of a single CPU system should be much higher than a dual/quad system. Welcome your thoughts." Except now you don't have just a "single cpu" system. You have a Kryotech-liquid refrigeration + single CPU system. Perhaps you can provide reliability history of this NEW Kryotech refrigeration system. What is the MTBF ? Paul

To: kash johal who wrote (81371)	5/23/1999 4:17:00 PM
From: Tony Viola	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 186894

Kash, Also the RAS of a single CPU system should be much higher than a dual/quad system. CPU chips or support chips aren't what tend to fail. They have FIT rates in the low double digits. It's hard drives, wires, boards, fans, anything mechanical, or cooling that fail at rates orders of magnitude more than chips. A Kryotech cooled system, IMO, will have very little chance of selling to anyone more serious than a home user, because of the inherently much higher chance of failure of anything non-semiconductor. And, that very little chance will be only if the Kryotech cooling system can demonstrate enough redundancy to result in a no single point of failure (NSPF). Back to the home user, what's he going to be doing to warrant goosing a machine to 1 GHz? I'd much rather have a 700 MHz PIII with RDRAM and air cooling myself. I'll sleep better at night knowing I have to do something important on it in the morning. No, I don't think the Kryos will sell except to the "mine's bigger than yours" types that have no regard for reliability. Tony

To: kash johal who wrote (81371)	5/23/1999 7:25:00 PM
From: Saturn V	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 186894

Kash, I have worked with cooled electronic systems for 15 years. They are not fun because the reliability is poorer. Moisture condensation is a primary problem. The moisture inevitably leads to corrosion of most electronic components. The only way to limit this problem is to encase the system is a hermetic case, and have vacuum inside the case. Unfortunately the vacuum suffers from minor leaks, and unless the system is pumped down annually you are asking for trouble. Temperature cycling is another headache. Cooling the system causes mechanical stress [ due to different coefficient of expansion of materials inside an electronic system, causing wires and cables to crack and snap]. Most of system failures show up in the first week of January. Despite explicit warnings, people tend to shut down systems during Christmas,[ the environtmentalists insist on conserving energy], causing the electronics to warm up, and the condensed moisture to melt, leading to corrosion. In January the system is powered back, and the failures due to corrosion and the temperature cycling show up. In summary cooled systems are much less reliable. Kyrotech cooling is OK for a supercomputer installation, but not for the average desktop.