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Pastimes : No to WTO! Seattle 1999 -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: PMS Witch who wrote (138)	12/4/1999 11:38:00 AM
From: Tom Clarke	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 187

If looted shopowners were allowed to shoot to kill, we would have no need of federalized paramilitary police, and the mob would be respectful of private property.

To: PMS Witch who wrote (138)	12/5/1999 2:23:00 PM
From: Mosko	Read Replies (4) \| Respond to of 187

Yes I agree, the cops did follow orders..... I live on Capitol Hill in Seattle. This is what I saw unfold. The untelevised story: Day 1: A.M. Massive numbers of demonstrators arrive. At noon Labor March begins scheduled with police to join up with rest of demonstrators and proceed on March to Seattle Center. Too many people, cops very nervous, under pressure from angry WTO members unable to enter that AM they begin with random tear gas attacks on demonstrators. Crowd just becomes more agitated. Hundreds of protestors had surrounded the Niketown in an effort to protect it from attacks by anarchists (24 of them) who have infiltrated crowd. This group made an attack at 10 AM but were rebuffed by PROTESTORS not police. They returned with the arrival of the Labor march where you saw what unfolded on TV.Those of us watching our city be trashed were disgusted, so were protestors, who watched their peaceful demonstration being gassed, while rioters weren't touched. This is when they cancelled the march to continue on to Seattle Center, fatal mistake, this left thousands of demonstrators who had a plan now being gassed and pelleted with rubber bullets with nowhere to go. A scared Paul Schell declares a state of emergency and the 7 pm curfew in downtown. As curfew nears police become more aggressive and begin to drive the crowd up to Capitol Hill outside of the no protest zone cops following protestors into nonrestricted residential neighborhoods gassing as they went. Day 1 commentary (what I thought at the time) This could be a riot, police did what they had to do. They were understaffed and responded the only way they know how. Day 2 Talk about overreaction! You saw it on TV. Arrest everyone in sight! Police, newly fortified by an influx of national guardsmen and state police start following protestors(maybe 200) outside of the noprotest zone, basically hunting them down. Gassing everybody trying to get to and from work or home. By early evening they were chasing a small group up here on Capitol Hill, WELL OUTSIDE THE CURFEW ZONE. By this time the crowd was building up with mainly spectators and angry residents. They were indiscriminately gassing throwing percussion bombs, shooting rubber bullets and pepperspraying. A friend of mine tried to show ID to show her address so she could continue on the sidewalk to her apartment SHE WAS PEPPER_SPRAYED 2 INCHES FROM HER EYES! Another friend was sitting in a coffeeshop on Broadway when gas cannister broke a window and gassed the occupants. Most broken windows on this day were from gas cannisters and rubber bullets. I tried to leave my building and was chased back inside. I watched from my roof as our CITYCOUNCILMAN who was trying to talk to the police was gassed and dragged away. I saw a medic who was trying to help someone on the street overcome by teargas grabbed and peppersprayed directly in the face! Many people could not get in to their homes until after midnight. All this in response to about 200 people in a nonrestricted residential neighborhood. SO MUCH FOR CIVIL RIGHTS! After being deluged by angry residents the mayor finally came on and made an apology. This was followed by redfaced police chief admitting no wrong saying he thought the police used remarkable restraint for a second day in a row! In other words, we should be thankful we didn't get our heads bashed in for walking down the street! Day 3 We all saw the peaceful demonstrations on this day. The police behaving the way they should. Riot police were waiting in the side streets just in case. I don't fault the police the way they handled this, they were following orders, but I think there is a serious problem with leadership and tactics used by the police. The fact that THEY ARE IN TOTAL DENIAL! about mistakes they made means they will learn nothing from this experience. I find this completely frightening. Realizing how easily my most basic freedoms to get to and from my home unmolested in peacetime can be taken from me in a relatively short episode of civic unrest begs the question: What would happen if there were a more extended problem? or perceived threat? YES THE COPS FOLLOWED ORDERS. NO! THE ORDERS WERE NOT CORRECT. Just realize. This could happen in your town in your neighborhood too. Mosko

To: PMS Witch who wrote (138)	12/6/1999 11:40:00 AM
From: The Philosopher	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 187

Wise people would assess the situation and realize that with the number of people involved, NO human, police or otherwise, would be able to determine with any accuracy an appropriate response to their presence and that given the overall behaviour of the crowd and the spirit of the gathering (confrontational) the police would treat everyone as a threat and respond with force. You sound very much like the police in Birmingham and Selma who set fire hoses and police dogs on the civil rights marchers. Their excuse was that they were faced with a confrontational gathering, and treated everyone as a threat and responded with force. The job of the police is to differentiate. It is hard to believe how a responsible police officer could look at a medic giving attention to a person lying on the ground and determine that the medic was a threat who needed to be gassed. If police can't make these distinctions, they shouldn't be out there taking the public's money. Our country in the past few decades has seen a number of civilian-police (used broadly) conflicts in which the police forces have gotten out of hand. The civil rights marches and demonstrations had numerous examples. Kent State. Chicago, 1968. Ruby Ridge. Waco. Now Seattle. These are, unfortunately, not isolated examples, but part of a pattern in which law enforcement officers go overboard, themselves becoming subject at times to a mob rule mentality, basically without accountability. It is another example of the truth of the adage: Power corrupts.