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Pastimes : Ask God -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Jamey who wrote (30024)	3/18/2000 3:17:00 PM
From: IN_GOD_I_TRUST	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 39621

James, I agree with you! Funny experiment I just heard about, which echos your sentiments. I will share it with you because I enjoyed it so much. Six apes in a cage. Someone sticks stairs in the cage and hangs bananas from the ceiling of the cage. The only way an ape can get a banana is to climb to the top of the stairs and grab one. First ape goes up the stairs to the top and trys to grab one. At the same time the ape is sprayed with a stream of water from a firehose, and the force of the water actually knocks him off the stairs. At the same time, the water gets all the other apes in the cage wet as well. Well, as you would expect, after many attempts of the apes trying to go up the stairs, only to get sprayed with water, and getting all the other apes wet, they stopped! Well, now one of the apes that was in the cage is replaced with another ape. The new ape, as soon as he gets in the cage, naturally goes right up the stairs to get a banana. But now the other apes knowing the new ape will get sprayed, and they will get wet as well, beat up the new ape until the new ape will not go up the stairs because he does not want to get pummeled. Now they take out another original ape, and replace it with a new one, and that ape naturally tries to go up the stairs to get a banana. Now the four original apes that remained pummel the newest ape, along with the other new ape. You see the first four apes remember the water spraying and beat up the new ape because they don't want to get sprayed. But the other new ape just knows if he went up the stairs, he gets pummelled. So he joins the original four in the beating, but for another reason. He just knows you go up the stairs and everyone pummels you. So the experiment goes on, with each of the original apes being removed, one by one. And as they remove every one of them, the same thing happens. The new one goes up the stairs, and all the other apes beat him. When all the originals were removed, none were left who went through the water experiment. But yet if you replaced one with a new one, all the apes would beat the new one up, but not one knew the original reason why they were doing it! You see, thats how we are. We follow without ever questioning the reason why. We just know someone before us did it this way, so we will too. I mean, my ancestors they couldn't have been wrong, right? I was born a conservative Jew. And this was one of my tremendous hurdles before coming to faith in Christ. I mean, my poor old, sweat, grandmother, she couldn't have been wrong about Christ, right? My mother and my father, my sisters, my whole family, they all can't be wrong? All those Jews before us, they can't ALL be wrong? Well, guess what. The were all WRONG!!!!!! It's a big problem, that people must get by. Don't follow the footsteps of those before you. Seek God's truth on your own so you are just not another ape, beating on another ape, and not knowing any reason why you are doing it..... God Bless, Steve

To: Jamey who wrote (30024)	3/18/2000 5:25:00 PM
From: IN_GOD_I_TRUST	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 39621

Santiago, You said, "I have not changed my mind about predestination because it is so prevailing in the Bible." No one is suggesting that you do change your mind. Otherwise they would be false teachers. Predestination is a definite in the bible. The only issue at hand is it predestination alone that saves. The bible clearly says salvation is not based on predestination alone, as clearly shown in Ephesians: Ephesians 1 1 Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus by the will of God, To the saints in Ephesus, [1] the faithful [2] in Christ Jesus: 2 Grace and peace to you from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ. 3 Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us in the heavenly realms with every spiritual blessing in Christ. 4 For he chose us in him before the creation of the world to be holy and blameless in his sight. In love 5 he [3] predestined us to be adopted as his sons through Jesus Christ, in accordance with his pleasure and will-- 6 to the praise of his glorious grace, which he has freely given us in the One he loves. 7 In him we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, in accordance with the riches of God's grace 8 that he lavished on us with all wisdom and understanding. 9 And he [4] made known to us the mystery of his will according to his good pleasure, which he purposed in Christ, 10 to be put into effect when the times will have reached their fulfillment--to bring all things in heaven and on earth together under one head, even Christ. 11 In him we were also chosen, [5] having been predestined according to the plan of him who works out everything in conformity with the purpose of his will, 12 in order that we, who were the first to hope in Christ, might be for the praise of his glory. 13 AND YOU ALSO were included in Christ when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation. Having believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, 14 who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God's possession--to the praise of his glory. Note verse 13. You can try to deny it, but thats what is says. You would be denying God's truth by denying it! God Bless Us All, Steve