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To: pgerassi who wrote (104445)	6/14/2000 12:42:00 PM
From: Joe NYC	Respond to of 186894

Pete, The other problem with typical benchmarks is the very thing that makes them easy to run and use, they are fixed. Here is where cheating occurs. The original intent of SPEC was to mimick the environment of typical workstation uses. The rules were put in place to restrict cheating. They have thus failed. All the major companies except for AMD use speciallized compilers just for this benchmark. I think at some point, when AMD starts to sell it's processors in server area, AMD will have to become a part of this cheating game. Even though I don't approve, I see it as inevitable. Joe

To: pgerassi who wrote (104445)	6/14/2000 5:40:00 PM
From: Elmer	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 186894

Re: "[Speaking of SPEC]All the major companies except for AMD use speciallized compilers just for this benchmark. The original intent was for it to be used as AMD first used it. Get your platform, get the available commercial compilers for that machine, find one that generates the quickest accurate code by testing and "playing around", and submit the best scores obtained overall with the same set of compiler settings" Pete you're batting zero. You have been wrong in just about everything you post. There are 8 AMD SPECint scores submitted to the SPEC organization and EVERY SINGLE ONE of them uses an Intel compiler. They know quality when they see it. specbench.org There are 9 AMD SPECfp scores submitted to SPEC and 5 use a Compaq compiler (which I believe now uses prefetch) and 4 using an Intel compiler. spec.org The changing of compiler options is something AMD does do, despite your statement, at least one time and the SPEC score reporting system allows for that. That's the difference between Baseline and Peak scores. BTW I noticed that Compaq used Intel's Fortran compiler for their 733MHz Professional Workstation SP750 and it even beats AMD's 1GHz system. Don't blame me, these are compaq scores. EP