Silicon Investor (SI) -- The First Internet Community

STOCKTALK

We've detected that you're using an ad content blocking browser plug-in or feature. Ads provide a critical source of revenue to the continued operation of Silicon Investor. We ask that you disable ad blocking while on Silicon Investor in the best interests of our community. If you are not using an ad blocker but are still receiving this message, make sure your browser's tracking protection is set to the 'standard' level.

Politics : PRESIDENT GEORGE W. BUSH -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Kevin Rose who wrote (133381)	3/25/2001 1:40:18 AM
From: Little Joe	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 769667

Kevin: “Don't know how having private schools affects guns in schools. “ I can’t either but I think I am correct that so far none of the gun incidents occurred in a private school. Also, my point was that the Courts by imposing rules that restrict the authority of the schools to search students and lockers were undermining the authority of our educators. “Private schools in poorer sections would face the same tough environment. “ Well here is my experience. My parents were divorced and my mother had a mental illness, so that as a child I rarely saw her. I went to a school in a poor neighborhood and at least 1/2 of the kids came from an orphanage located across the street from the school. It was a Catholic School and the nuns were tough as nails. No child was permitted to use poverty, or family circumstances as an excuse. They just demanded the best from us This was a poor school. The text books had been around for years. At the end of each year we had to repair the text books. We would tape pages that had been ripped and sand the edges of the books. We had to sand our desks so that any graffitti would be removed. Of course there wasn’t any for obvious reasons. Corporal punishment was the order of the day. By the way although there were only about 15 kids in my eighth grade class, the 7th and 8th grade were taught in the same classroom by one nun. I lived in Baltimore City at the time. There was a very fine public school called Baltimore Polytechnic. To get into this school, required the passing of an examination. If you scored high enough you qualified for the A course. It was a boys only school at that time. If you passed but did not score high enough you qualified for the B course. Out of our class of 15, 3 passed the exam with grades high enough to qualify for the A course. So much for the idea that you can’t educate kids who have it tough. To complete the story, my family moved away and in the tenth grade, I went to a public school in our new neighborhood. It was the first time I realized that teacher’s prepared their lessons. This was because about 1/2 of the teachers simply were not prepared to teach the class. A problem that has gotten worse since then. “2) Again, the risk of excluding 'harder to educate' students is to create a class system. But I understand the counter argument; why should other students suffer? Equal opportunity at education means that there will be some suffering as the cost; we can't get around that.” If I understand your argument, you are saying that despite the difficulties such students cause we should allow them to remain in school. My view is that education is an opportunity and if you come to school and make no effort, disrupt the class and miss classes all the time, you just lose your opportunity. Anything else is not fair to the other students. Then we have students who are never going to be educated. e.g. Due to Federal laws we have to educate and even try to “mainstream” autistic children, as an example. The plain fact is that the public school system is not equipped to teach these children and the attempt to mainstream them just hurts other students. This does not mean that we should ignore these kid’s needs. It means we need to find a better way to address them. Little joe

To: Kevin Rose who wrote (133381)	3/25/2001 2:30:29 AM
From: greenspirit	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 769667

Kevin, public schools are suffering mainly because of the "system". I'll try and make this as brief as possible. Whenever you create a system which is disconnected to the customers and end users, the system will move toward the "path of least resistance". Whenever someone desires to understand the behavior of people in a system. The first thing to examine is the reward mechanism. Because, "people do what you reward them for doing". Having said that, let's look at how the NEA, teachers, principals and administrators are rewarded in public education. Are they rewarded for outstanding student performance? Perhaps, for some in an intrinsic way. Others, absolutely not. Are they rewarded for responding in real ways to the parents, or student needs? Again, not really. So, how are they rewarded? The system of rewards in public education is tied to the funding source. The funding source is linked to political special interests. Therefore, those who are politically motivated, and or politically connected, get ahead, and get rewarded. People in the system take the "path of least resistance", (if they decide to remain), and align themselves with the reward system. Vouchers (although not a panacea), change this linkage. Vouchers align the system of education toward the real customers, the parents and students, where it should have always remained. They control the funding, so they are much more likely to have their needs met. Think about this carefully Kevin, and I am sure you'll agree. The delivery of knowledge through our education system works just like a business works. Whenever a business loses touch with the end users, and forgets who their true customers are, quality steadily deteriorates. That is why vouchers make sense. Vouchers empower the true customers. Not the bureaucrats, politicians and special interests. It won't be a panacea, and it must be done in conjunction with leaders who understand the concepts of meeting customer needs as well as continuous improvement. But it can be done, every American car company has already proven that. With sustained effort, and focused leadership built around a system which encourages the right king of behavior. Our public education system can be the envy of the world again. Without vouchers, or a similar system which empowers the end users, any effort at reform which does not get to the root cause of the problem "structure", is a waste of time. Michael