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To: Hawkmoon who wrote (67397)	4/9/2001 12:26:48 AM
From: d:oug	Respond to of 116912

"...my track record is a bet better than theirs.Regards,Ron" Yes ron, easy to predict the results of a continued manipulated game. No problem either, to do so. But to do, while at the same time proclaiming your insight is derived from a better understanding of markets forces than others, is quite a falsehood when market forces are being manipulated such that things like Supply & Demand equations are tampered with to generate a different output for inputs that in the past generated expected answers. To put it in simple words ron, you are a fake. Will we find out the truth about you ron, or will i continue to cry "ron-ron" like "wolf" over and over with your story being the day's reality? Yes, when bubbles crash and the wealth of paper fiat money becomes only as valuable as the trees glue and ink used to create it. As for the wealth lost in the Dow and Nasdaq, one has to wonder what is real and where, and if it was real in the first place. For example, out of thin air the usa government creates fiat currency worth a trillion dollars and gives it to the banks which loan it out to people who invested into those dot-com companies last year that now have collapsed. ok, so that money was created out of trees etc for a cost of $10,000 to make a trillion dollars. Its gone, or is it? Someone holds "title" to it. Most likely the bank waiting for those people to pay it back each month on a statement saying Minimum Due. But wait, does not the usa government really hold "final" title as in they loaned it to the banks? And if the banks can not get it from the people, then the government can not get it back from the banks, then with governernment=people why in the bell should the people bail out the banks? Imagine if the Fed does not, then where is the money? The people invested into dot-com(s) and lost. But each loser has a winner, so who are the winners. Can we "follow" the fiat money flow here? Seems that that is all that needed ron. ron, let it be paper fiat money or just a digital glow inside an electronic balance sheet, the money was created, still exist, so who "touched" it last? Next question, or might it be a statement. Does that fiat money created still have value if it did not do that thing you reference lots of times in you cut & pastes, as in did it created wealth in the form of goods or services to equal its creation so that it caused no dilution/inflation. Actually ron you are like a fiat person, your posts are created out of nothing except others hot air that creates no wealth. ak

To: Hawkmoon who wrote (67397)	4/9/2001 12:44:27 AM
From: Rarebird	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 116912

<Since the gold bugs have been wrong for the past 2 years> The "gold bugs" have been predicting the demise of the NAZ well before it occurred, Ron, and guess what? They were right! Before you can build a beautiful new building or tulip you have to destroy the existing one first. Last I saw, NEM and ABX were trading higher than CSCO, NT and YHOO. "But each loser has a winner, so who are the winners." Doug AK Answer: Gold Stocks PS It's a funny thing about financial insurance, Ron, the "gold bugs" only have to be right once to Collect and proclaim Victory. HAHAHA! Got Gold? Got Guns? Got Guts?

To: Hawkmoon who wrote (67397)	4/9/2001 7:36:57 AM
From: long-gone	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 116912

but will you continue? or are you afraid to publish these estimates? I thought you had said before gold would go to $70? Is the $225.10 the bottom? What about year end? Average? These are the most important to indicate future price one would think.Top for the year?

To: Hawkmoon who wrote (67397)	4/9/2001 8:12:39 AM
From: long-gone	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 116912

OK, you'll all love this tripe looks like the entire world problem of foot(hoof) & mouth may have been caused by a Liberal Animal Rights Activist Terrorist! STOLEN FOOT-AND-MOUTH VIRUS 'RELEASED DELIBERATELY' 18:30 Sunday 8 April 2001 The foot-and-mouth outbreak could have been started deliberately by someone who stole a test-tube of the virus from a laboratory. The Sunday Express says a container of foot-and-mouth virus went missing from a secret Government lab at Porton Down in Wiltshire two months before the crisis began. The disappearance was discovered during a routine audit of the sensitive unit, which also houses smallpox, TB, anthrax and Ebola. The newspaper says there are rumours the missing test-tube could have been taken by an animal rights activist. The paper quotes a 'senior military source close to Porton Down' as saying: "A phial appears to have gone missing from one of the labs following a routine audit last year. "Ministry officials were informed immediately and an investigation was launched initially by Special Branch and then by MI5, who are interested in the activities of animal rights protesters." It says questions will be tabled in parliament about the Porton Down link this week. A Department of Health spokesman wouldn't comment but the paper said an agriculture ministry spokesman said the matter was being investigated. The paper also claims it has seen documents confirming some sheep carried the virus long before the outbreak was confirmed on February 20. According to a Welsh vet, it was in Wales as early as January, says the paper. Timber merchants say they were approached by the Ministry of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food in early February to supply wood for pyres. Agriculture minister Nick Brown insisted this was part of a "regular contingency planning exercise". He told the paper: "There are a number of urban legends doing the rounds that the ministry knew about this disease before. That is not true." lineone.net

To: Hawkmoon who wrote (67397)	5/1/2001 7:48:31 AM
From: long-gone	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 116912

And if their hacking attempts move from the military into the monetary realm? Vengeful Chinese Attack U.S. Web Sites NewsMax.com Wires Tuesday, May 1, 2001 WASHINGTON (UPI) - Chinese computer hackers launched a massive attack Monday against U.S. Web sites, including those run by the Navy and Air Force. It appears to be a highly coordinated campaign organized by ordinary citizens but tolerated by the dictatorship in Beijing. For the first time since the year 2000 turnover, the Pentagon has put all military and defense agency network administrators on heightened alert for hackers until May 8, according to Defense Department sources. The military is now at "INFOCON ALPHA," a cyber-version of the physical threat condition, warning that systems may come under attack, according to Lt. Cdr Peter Reif, a spokesman for the Navy's Fleet Information Warfare Center. Chinese and American hackers have warned of a hacking war between April 30 and May 8. While it is difficult to conclusively pinpoint the origin of computer attacks, activity over the past week on Chinese Internet traffic, newsgroups and hacker websites suggest that Chinese programmers and amateurs are responsible, experts told United Press International. "They are calling it several names including `The Sixth Network War of National Defense,' or `the 51 war,' meaning May first," said Jerry Freese, director of intelligence for Vigilinx, a digital security firm that claims to monitor more than 7,000 Web sites for security breaches. ``What's surprising is the level of organization we're seeing. This is not just a casual attack done on a whim. We believe that the government is tolerating this action," Freese said. One former justice department official said that jurisdictional obstacles made it impossible for U.S. authorities to prosecute those guilty, and that asking the Chinese regime to help would not only be pointless if it is indeed behind the attacks, but also could help China justify stifling the use of the Internet by political dissidents. Freese said that while all attacks might not be reported, as of 4 p.m. EDT 13 federal government sites, two state government sites, eight commercial and two educational sites had been hit. United Press International's site was changed around 3:30 a.m. with the company's usual home page featuring a logo, scrolling news and links to related sites replaced with a fluttering Chinese flag and several lines of copy in Chinese characters and English letters. The illiterate English part of the message read: "The Great Chinese Nation Hooray!!!! USA Will Be With Responsibility for the Accident Totally!!! Protest USA sell Weapon to Taiwan, Break The World Peace!!! USA IS BITCH! I am From China - Peak." American hackers swiftly responded by defacing 15 Web sites in China with ethnic jokes and calls for hackers to join the war, expected to last all week, wired.com reported. Other altered sites included: the Departments of Labor, Energy, and Health and Human Services; whitehousehistory.org; sites involving U.S.-Japan relations and Taiwan sites. The altered sites generally contained messages similar to that placed on the UPI page. 'A Warning Bell' UPI Editor-in-Chief John O'Sullivan said: "No great harm seems to have been done on this occasion. It was cyber-nuisance rather than cyber-terror. But it was a warning bell that we all need to prepare better countermeasures against a growing problem." Last week, National Infrastructure Protection Center issued a warning that Chinese interests might be hacking into Web sites in conjunction with May Day celebrations today. Dozens of Web sites have been hacked in recent weeks by Chinese supporters who replace the usual information with anti-American slogans and pictures of the fighter pilot who collided with the U.S. surveillance plane. Copyright 2001 by United Press International. All rights reserved. newsmax.com

To: Hawkmoon who wrote (67397)	5/7/2001 2:13:56 PM
From: long-gone	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 116912

follow-up Sunday May 6 1:23 PM ET Advanced Science Sees Gold in South Dakota Mine By Alden Bentley NEW YORK (Reuters) - In a sort of reverse alchemy, physicists are seeking to transform America's deepest gold mine from a money pit into a treasure trove for advanced science. If the plan succeeds, a mile and a half down the historic but soon-to-be-defunct Homestake Mine in South Dakota is where big dollars will advance human knowledge of the smallest sub-atomic matter and give a cash-strapped state an economic shot in the arm. The newly formed National Consortium of Underground Science hopes to put the world's largest particle physics lab in the hole before California-based Homestake Mining Co. switches off the drills, lights and pumps late this year and lets the costly 125-year-old mine fill with water. It would be the mother lode, in terms of jobs for South Dakota's impoverished Black Hills region. ``Some people have been quoted as calling this the 'Cape Canaveral of physics' or the 'next Los Alamos,''' said Jay Carson, aide to Tom Daschle, the senior U.S. Senator from South Dakota who is striving to sell the project in Washington. Big Science Mine Field In Washington Daschle said through his aide: ``We're guardedly optimistic about the prospects of the lab coming to and being completed at the Homestake mine.'' But budget politics threaten the lab because it will cost some $250 million to turn this artifact of the nation's pioneer economy into a Mecca for cutting-edge PhDs. That price tag nevertheless presents a far smaller target to spending foes than the Texas superconducting super collider, an $11 billion atom smasher terminated eight years ago after $2 billion had been lavished on the county sized contraption. Proponents say $250 million is a bargain compared to the cost of burrowing 7,500 feet into virgin rock -- about the only place where sensitive experiments on specks like neutrinos can be shielded from cosmic rays and other barely measurable disturbances. Even more so since researchers from many fields could share the lab to explore the mysteries of the universe -- search for dark matter, understand supernovae, study radioactivity, trace little-understood ground water movements and hunt for new life forms that exist with no sunlight. The subterranean platform will also make it easier to detect violations of the global nuclear test ban. Something For Everyone ``The remarkable thing about the National Underground Laboratory is that it addresses problems in nuclear physics, particle physics, biology, materials science and geophysics,'' said physicist John Bahcall of the Institute for Advanced Studies at Princeton University in Princeton, New Jersey. Bahcall is chairman of the National Underground Laboratory Committee, charged by the National Science Foundation (news - web sites) to study proposals and recommend a location. ``I have to say that for the 40 years now that I've been associated with large national projects, this one has more enthusiasm and more immediately widespread approval than any other than I've been associated with,'' he said. The proposed lab would also feature an underground visitors center, counting on 100,000 tourists a year. But the hype has yet to infect the new administration, now haggling with Congress over its pledged tax and spending cuts. The White House budget reduced National Science Foundation funding and specified no new starts of major projects in 2002. High Tech Jobs The lab would direct federal dollars into depressed South Dakota and, according to the Rapid City Journal, provide employment for hundreds and a long-term future for tiny Lead, helping the town recover from the loss of its major employer. The Homestake location has the advantage of being in a state eligible for some federal funding because of its lack of money for engineering and science technology, according to Bahcall. At the South Dakota School of Mines and Technology, Charles Kliche, director of mining engineering, was active in boosting nearby Homestake. His school now stands to manage the facility, in conjunction with major universities in and outside the state. ``We helped spearhead the effort and the committee that was looking at where to locate the facility has chosen Homestake,'' Kliche said. ``Now we just need funding from Congress.'' The South Dakota site is preferred over California rival Mount San Jacinto near Palm Springs. Its depth provides the lowest background levels of interference from the cosmos and Homestake has housed a small version of the lab for decades. ``It exits and one could move science into the laboratory in six months to a year after it being funded,'' Professor Bahcall said. ``It would take at lease five years to do that at San Jacinto.'' Bahcall said it is well worth building a lab to conduct American experiments in particle physics -- now done in Japan, Russia, Finland and Italy -- if the facility could be the world showpiece. Homestake Mining Posterity Minded As for Homestake Mining, the longest continually listed company on the New York Stock Exchange (news - web sites) hopes it has a shot at a good citizenship award. The company has already donated the lease on a smaller mine being closed in California for use as a nature preserve and environmental research station. ``We feel that for mining to continue to get approval as something society allows in North America, we better be thinking about the legacy that we leave behind at each mine,'' said Homestake chief executive Jack Thompson. Given legal fees, Thompson said the company will not benefit financially from turning over Homestake's 600 miles of tunnels and excavations, which it can no longer afford to operate in an era of low bullion prices. Homestake was a symbol of the 19th century gold rush that funded America's westward expansion. It may yet become synonymous with the frontiers of 21st century science. But before the mine can get a new lease on life, the company and the state of South Dakota insist on getting legal protection because of residual hazards from chemicals used in both mining and some experiments to be done in the lab. ``We feel very confident that putting this National Science Foundation lab in the Homestake Mine is a win-win for the economy and the environment and we're taking every precautionary step that we can to make sure that that's true,'' Daschle said. Daschle is currently sponsoring indemnification legislation in Congress against liability for both parties. dailynews.yahoo.com