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To: Elmer who wrote (139647)	7/19/2001 1:19:42 AM
From: Tony Viola	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 186894

Elmer, >Someone needs to let the air out of this one that IBM is a top notch silicon manufacturer. I am personally involved in a project which relies on an IBM fab and quite frankly Intel would be ashamed if they were producing the same low yields we have consistently seen. IBM may have all the latest process whistles and bells but they are far from world class manufacturers. In their CC today, IBM blamed their microelectronics division a lot for their Q2 so so performance. They also said that division would not produce well the rest of the year. Their best results were with their services, mainframes and big Unix servers. Intel based were off a bit, like with the other OEMs. Hopefully, Windows Data Center, Whistler and XP (also Linux) kickstart Intel servers in a few months. Tony

To: Elmer who wrote (139647)	7/19/2001 1:24:48 AM
From: Saturn V	Read Replies (4) \| Respond to of 186894

Ref < Someone needs to let the air out of this one that IBM is a top notch silicon manufacturer > Elmer, we have to give credit where its due. IBM has indeed been a great innovator and leader in silicon process technology. IBM developed the resists for UV lithography, Chip planirazation technology (CMP), flip chip technology and Copper interconnect technology, and Silicon Germanium technology. IBM has liberally licensed these technologies to Intel and others. However IBM Microelectronics has not leveraged its process innovation with good products. It has mostly built products for its in house mainframe business, where yields do not matter as much. For mainframes performance and reliability means everything, and the chip cost is a tiny fraction of the total system cost. SOI is a good innovation. However SOI has been attempted for 30 years by several companies ( Silicon on Sapphire) and one of its major problems was terrible yields. It is not clear if the yield of IBM's SOI approach will be comparable to bulk silicon, since IBM has not been as yield conscious as other chip suppliers. So AMD is taking a gamble, and time will tell if this gamble will pay off.

To: Elmer who wrote (139647)	7/19/2001 1:49:43 AM
From: Paul Engel	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 186894

Elmer - re: "Someone needs to let the air out of this one that IBM is a top notch silicon manufacturer. I am personally involved in a project which relies on an IBM fab and quite frankly Intel would be ashamed if they were producing the same low yields we have consistently seen. IBM may have all the latest process whistles and bells but they are far from world class manufacturers. If only we could get our wafers from an Intel fab...." Hmmmmmmm...maybe that's why IBM's Lightning 486 and PowerPC programs have been less than successful !! Just how bad are their yields? You can disguise the answer with a number between 0 and 100 !

To: Elmer who wrote (139647)	7/19/2001 9:26:38 AM
From: Dan3	Respond to of 186894

Re: If only we could get our wafers from an Intel fab.... There is currently a worldwide collapse in semi demand of all kinds. The earnings reports we just saw shows that Intel is operating on the same planet as the rest of us. Despite the current lack of demand for semi products, Intel has been investing in its FABs, and expanding their capacity at 2.5 times the "regular" rate for several quarters. Intel has recently delayed several FABs, citing lack of demand for their capacity (which is a worldwide function, not a specific lack of demand for Intel products). So, why can't you get your wafers from an Intel FAB?