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Pastimes : The Literary Sauna (or Tomes in Towels) -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Rambi who wrote (398)	8/28/2001 11:58:55 AM
From: epicure	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 466

But not all men were like that. I'm listening to John Adams- and Abigail Adams writes to her husband with a very modern voice. Last night I heard a letter in which she urged her husband not to "forget the ladies" in the new constitution. She said that ladies can be at the mercy of tyrants- that laws are not needed to protect women from good husbands, only from bad- so what could be the harm of curbing the unlimited power of bad men over their wives. I found the letter very interesting. Of course John Adams made a little joke about her views in his next letter, but the fact that she felt she could write such a letter to him, and express such feelings, tells you a good deal. I liked the accentuating of the post partum situation in the Yellow Wallpaper, btw.

To: Rambi who wrote (398)	8/28/2001 12:24:19 PM
From: E	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 466

That story is back-to-back symbolism, and nothing feels contrived, and it is so smart. Right away, up front, we have 'ancestral halls,' and 'a hereditary estate.' You have to laugh. Here are some of my favorite lines: "He is very careful and loving, and hardly lets me stir without special direction." "...he takes all care from me [ie away from], and so I feel basely ungrateful not to value it more." "...he hates to have me write a word." "He knows there is no reason to suffer, and that satisfies him." "What is it, little girl?..." "'Bless her little heart!' he said with a big hug...." I liked the "blessed little goose" line, and "dear John gathered me up in his arms, and just carried me upstairs and laid me on the bed, and sat by me and read to me till it tired my head" lines. And "He said I was his darling and his comfort and all he had, and that I must take care of myself for his sake, and keep well." -- Ah, the rewards of compliance. Security over the risky pursuit of fulfillment, what a temptation. It's real for every woman (the lucky ones who get offers to be somebody's baby) (though less real than it was before women won the right/obligation to work full time and do most of the taking care of the children and house, too (which reminds me of a line from a novel by William Burroughs, "You ween [win] some kind of jellyfish, meester"), and would be for every man, except that they aren't usually offered the choice. Still, in their arenas, they make versions of that choice all the time. I feel I must mention here that men do not have an easy time of it, either, in this world. I wouldn't trade places for anything. I might have been tempted in 1899, though. I loved "fireworks in my pillowcase" metaphor! Don't you know that feeling! All the infantilizing language was so interesting and well done. The thing is, I can, how you say, get behind all that. The temptation of it. Well, there's a lot more to say about the story, but I have to get some work done now. The descent into madness and the florid madness was brilliant. I am wondering what everyone takes the meaning/s of the ending to be....

To: Rambi who wrote (398)	8/28/2001 5:38:01 PM
From: The Philosopher	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 466

It is amazing to think that men saw us as so fundamentally different from them. Uh, past tense, Penni dear? What about "Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus"? What about the joke about the genie choosing to build the bridge to Hawaii rather than try to explain what women want. In humor are often seeds of truth. I hate to clue you in, but lots of men STILL see you as fundamentally different from us. Not so much in the intellectual realm any more, we're getting over that hurdle finally (though it's not over yet), but in other ways, definitely.