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To: Horgad who wrote (76172)	9/12/2001 11:06:28 AM
From: Real Man	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 116753

The tragedy has left us with a very unpleasant situation, and it is unclear what action we have to take, whether to bomb them or not. These guys are not Europeans, like in former Yugoslavia, who may fear and respect us at the first sight of bombs falling. They have blood revenge, and will likely engage in more terrorist acts should the massive bombings start. On the other hand, leaving this unpunished will also likely encourage them for more terrorist acts. Very unpleasant situation, which will likely escalate in future in case of ANY policy action. Fear is probably the best weapon we may have. Kill lots of innocent people, so that they fear to cause such destruction. On the other hand, this may cause more destruction on both sides. Pretty ugly, and this may just be the beginning.

To: Horgad who wrote (76172)	9/12/2001 11:14:57 AM
From: IngotWeTrust	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 116753

The earth is soaked with the blood of humans and beasts allright. And there will be more blood shed by innocents and deliberates until we, the strong, the angry and the right get the job done and done right, and strong survive and then strongly rule in peace. Those with spreading the pap about the garden of eden god being the evil liar and the snake was correct and righteous are no where to be found these last several days. You can bet your goldbug ass he's hiding and hoping someone will do his dirty defending work for him as well. Cowardice takes many forms, laughter and derision are just one, and twisting truth to get reactions and broadband width time and space are another. Mainly cowardice is under the guise of "tolerance" and "can't we just all get along" bullpuckey upon which it arrives. Well, since it is about 10,000 plus dead NewYork Americans as the our latest proof that we "can't all just get along," I suggest that we quit trying that approach before we reach the carnage of MILLIONS of deceased, annihilated Jews that taught us the lesson last time that caused us to take out Hitler. If we don't do it, even with the Russian's help like we had last time, who's gonna? One of the things that fundamentalist Falwell is going to have to go back and cover now is where it's okay for "christians" to get angry, and about what, and then what to do about it proactively. This trying to sanctify humans out of their positive anger, dissect it, debred it, and otherwise cauterize a healthy human emotion from the spectrum of being fully human, fully god's image-ness, and fully alive is the slippery slope you MUST walk if you want to be mentally healthy. It's hard to be mentally healthy and be an anger suppressing "Liberty/Falwell Baptist" let me assure you! (BTW, did you know that Falwell is also a goldbug?) Most of you GPMer's venerate Murphy's "mad as hell and won't take it anymore" mantra but when a sodbuster from Kansas origins little woman stands up on here and says, "I AM, as in I AM focused, I AM calm, I AM coolheaded, I AM collected, I AM purposeful and I AM right, you all suddenly think that anger is wrong and unhealthy? GET REAL! Mostly bible/koran/torah thumping fundamentalists just sweep anger under the rug of all the Love sermons, religious instruction classes and fundraising activities of the corporate church/synagogue/mosques of this globe. And that has been a collosal mistake in my evaluation of over 50 years of observation of the effects of religious denial of the righteous purpose of our god-endowed right to be angered and angry. But the bible's/koran's/torah's god is an ANGRY god and each religion has many examples preserved of our "hands and feet of god" humans doing what needs to be done and conquering and prospering and surviving as the result. That's why this nation stands with Israel, and will continue to do so. You don't like it? Either join the army here or face the army elsewhere. The choice is yours. It can get reeeeeeeeeeeal black and white when push comes to shove. And the blood of right and wrong will taint the global soil again, until the strong survive. Sure glad you and your ilk were defeated in WWI and WWI and looks like we get to whup ass again in WWIII unless god has a couple more sulfuric/brimstone displays up his/her sleeves...

To: Horgad who wrote (76172)	9/12/2001 11:46:24 AM
From: Gord Bolton	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 116753

My heart goes out to the direct victims of this attack, to all the people of New York, and the USA and especially to all of the children who have been robbed of the love and support of their parent(s). It is the children who have suffered the biggest loss and for all those who are confused and do not know what to do with their grief and anger, let me suggest that you something real and positive for all of the new orphans. Calamity and loss are an irrevokable part of the human experience. There is a special quality to the grief and loss which comes from the direct acts of other human beings. Everyone who has faced the consequences of such acts knows the inner turmoil whether they are the ones directly affected or are responsible for helping the victims or handling the offenders for that matter. There are some things which we should all be aware of in ourselves and in others. We all go through similiar stages of grief which will include denial, anger, hopeless bargaining and eventually acceptance that the loss is real and lasting. Initially a large loss may be near totally debilitating and the victims amy need massive support to return to "normal" functioning. The victim must first be converted to a survivor, which would generally mean that they can return to normal functioning without the need for massive support. The next stage that they might progress towards is to become a warrior who would fight to ensure that no one else is subject to the enormous grief that they have suffered at the hands of their fellow human beings. And finally, hopefully they might eventually progress emotionally and spiritually to become a peacemaker who recognizes that there are many victims out there who have never had their losses and grievances addressed and who are trying desperately to deal with their own distress and inner turmoil. Many who have suffered grievous loss at the hands of humans have not received the massive support that is neccessary to recover and become a survivor. They remain the walking wounded who are blind to effects of their own actions toward their fellows and the tender children in our midst. In conclusion, if you are a healthy adult and are not immediately needed to man a post somewhere and you are confused and distressed and don't know what to do with your self-- look around you and figure out what you can do to help the children.