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To: craig crawford who wrote (134576)	11/10/2001 9:03:26 PM
From: Skeeter Bug	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 164684

>>it's not an issue of whether or not they have it soooo good or not.<< ok, thanks for acknowledging you would be unwilling to live like these folks b/c they actually have it quite bad. >>the issue stems from the fact that they have an incentive to break the law and come to our country illegally because liberals give them handouts. don't dodge the issue; is what i said true or not?<< i already said that was true. i'm not dodging anything.<< >>whoops! no need to answer my previous question in another post--you just admitted it. there are incentives for illegal immigrants to break the law and come to our country illegally.<< why this fascination w/ dodging... not everybody thinks like you and dodges questions that expose hypocrisy. >>there are children who are exploited all across the world. many more exploited than are free. are you suggesting that america throw it's borders wide open and say come stay with us we will take care of all of you?<< it w/b nice to take care of all folks the way america has taken care of you, but it can't. that is why reasonable immigration is the answer. granted, one person's "reasonable immigration" is another "choke hold" is another "floodgate." ;-) >>you are letting your liberal mindset cloud reason and rationality.<< craig, just b/c your mind can only think in simple label terms, don't hoist them onto me. they don't fit. i am not a "liberal" and i don't have a "liberal" mindset. i am a free thinker that thinks through the issues. i do try and follow the golden rule, though. "do unto others as you would have them do unto you." i don't strive to have a heart of stone. nor do live in an idealized world. there are realities that temper what reasonably can and can't be done to reflect goodness in the world. of course, if you were in serious need, you would want others to shut the door on you and allow you to die, right? and your kids, right? you would understand and smile as your kid's body tore up hsi muscle fiber to use as energy, right? after all, a person that could help YOU can't help EVERYONE. right, craig? i do have compassion for others b/c i could have been in their situation. by the grace of god i am not. frankly, only by the grace of god. therefore, i don't think it is a bad thing to make an honest attempt to treat others as i would like to be treated should i have been in their shoes. it is what god says he wants us to do, if you believe the bible. no, we can't save the world. but that doesn't mean we cripple our compassion and harden our hearts against god's creation. >>liberals are the party of good intentions but no results.<< liberal politicians (like all politicians) tend to be extremely slimey. they say they care about the poor in an effort to gain power. they'd hop on one leg and spank their ss instead if they felt it would help their own personal cause more. you make statements you can't prove and don't even know you can't prove them b/c, rather than think, you regurgitate the party line. saying "we spent X $ on welfare and poverty increased anyway" doesn't mean those dollars were wasted or that there were "no results" to a rational, thinking mind. it might mean that and it might not. the problem is that you don't have the results of the alternative to gauge it against. perhaps poverty would have been double the current level. the result was a 50% reduction in poverty. but, rather than HONESTLY admit you don't know the impact, you say you do. that is misleading. if you keep doing it, it becomes dishonest. but, you don't need data and proof and all that kind of intellectually honest crap. you have the party line "repeat it enough and people will believe it is true" propaganda decoder ring! ;-) >>it doesn't take any thought or reason to say that it's terrible for babies to die in the streets. it does take some reason to say we cannot succeed even if we choose to try to prevent things like that. it's too bad liberals believe that if they act like they care enough, things will somehow be better.<< we can't help everyone so f 'em? well, it isn't that bad, right craig, b/c you would use better language to describe how you'd treat 'em (and i'm sure they would appreciate that!) nice attitude, craig. i hope in your time of need that a person (or deity) able to help you doesn't "treat you as you would treat them (his beloved creation)." i understand the tough guy, "hey, i'm doing fine, what's the problem, screw everybody else" attitude. i see it as the cause of a lot of problems rather than the solution. >>compassion is a nice thing, but it doesn't accomplish a damn thing if it's not put to use in a constructive way.<< totally agree. however, the "me first" (ring, ring, ring a bell, craig?) attitude among the politicians will ensure that "constructive" doesn't happen b/c it doesn't serve the "me first" needs of the folks in power very well. >>intentions are meaningless.<< not necessarily. >>results are what count.<< true. however, intentions often lead to results. w/o intentions, you are all but guaranteed no results. intentions w/o results are pretty darn meaningless, though. intentions leading to results can be quite valuable. >>you can have all the good intentions in the world, but the only way to nmake a difference is to get results. the liberal intentions cause more harm than good.<< again, making statements that you can't back up. well, as long as it makes you feel good... ;-) just so you know, i don't support all liberal or conservative legislation or agendas. your wide brush doesn't allow me to comment further.