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Politics : Islam, The Message -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: greenspirit who wrote (245)	11/18/2001 1:52:57 PM
From: mr_stevenson	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 758

Michael, ++++If the same kind of scrutiny were applied to other religions, I doubt they would pass the test with complete flying colors too However, the only difference with other religions (at least the major ones such as Christianity and to some extend Jewdism) is that they have been sanitized and have been properly adjusted to meet the more humanistic aspects of 21st century and beyond. Besides, they do not have such great followings as Islam does to create any threats to our civilization. Compare to other major religions (already sanitized), Islam by all standards and in its present form constitutes a framework that by far exceeds its peer religions in promoting violence, hatred and oppression of thoughts and soul. It provides a framework that tells people exactly what to do. It is a way of life. Its teachings range from politics, economics, having sex, eating, beating, killing, praying, doing good, how to threat others, when to threat others, etc. etc. etc. It is meant to provide a detail framework for people to follow. It has 1.2 billion followers with the majority being either poor or uneducated, or both. The reason it has so many followers and is considered to be the fastest growing religion on earth is that it is most popular among the poor and the uneducated (which goes to show with all the progress we have made as human beings, we really have not accomplished much)! The Poor and the uneducated tend to find it much easier to be told as what to do than to think for themselves. When you have a religion that is not sanitized, and is meant to create a framework for the complete control of human mind and thought process, and is followed by the poor and uneducated, you end up having with a world that refuses to use its own intellect to distinguish between the right and the wrong. Nazism, and Communism meant to also do the same by providing a detail framework of thought process for people to live their lives. This in my view is dangerous to the human race. Just read Mr. Alsuezi's post. He is not willing to even question the verse in Quran that talks about a man beating his wife for which he believes it is from God and he does not wish to question God's wisdom! The same with Mohammad Atta and his thugs and murderers who thought they were doing good based on specific verses in Quran which they refused to question for which they also thought there were coming straight from God. What baffles me is that they were not poor or uneducated (like the vast majority of population in Islamic countries are), and that is what worries me greatly. I liked your comment where you stated; "The events of 9/11 have crystallized in my mind that we cannot afford to sit-back and assume they will get the message that freedom and democracy works best. We must unabashedly promote it, like we promote a can of Coka-Cola." Perhaps, only then Islam can be sanitized. Sincerely, Soroush Stevenson

To: greenspirit who wrote (245)	11/18/2001 2:14:13 PM
From: mr_stevenson	Respond to of 758

I am posting the following comments from user name: IN_GOD_I_TRUST (IGIT). he sent this to me through private message. I found his comments reasonable, and since I have come to read his other posts on SI, I find him to be honest, open minded and very logical. Since he is among the people that Mr. Alsuezi has blocked from this thread I am going to post his comments here for him: From IGIT: ============================= Michael, I wish I could do this on the thread, but I am blocked. You said, "If the same kind of scrutiny were applied to other religions, I doubt they would pass the test with complete flying colors too." Firstly, I am not sure I would make such a statement without firstly investigating a fair number of them. I think I could do a good job with what I believe. But I am not choosing to on SI, nor would start a thread too. I have been challenged a number of times with what I believe in these Islamic conversations. And I have invited all challenges with starting a new thread to go through those points. But the focus on these threads is Islam. If I have to, I will start a new one. But the focus is on Islam right now, as it should be because of current events. I don't believe one drowning should pull under water as many as they could on the way down to feel better that they are not the only one. Thats why other beliefs come into play on these Islam threads, not because people really want to know about them. But you are right in this way, if someone is looking to disprove something with all of their being, they probably will, at least in their own mind. But Amein has invited people to try to get to the bottom of Islam. And we are doing so because of the terroirst acts, acts which were not positive actions! So the negative verses that the radicals are using to justify terrorism is what is being explored. If a Muslim wants to show us positive ones that contradict the negative ones (the terroristic or warring ones), or verses that put a better light on the negative ones, that would be great. But the discussion is negative in nature because of September 11th. Also, the Taliban way of life has come under scrutiny because they are in bed with the Al Qaeda. That's where womens rights came in. So I think you were a bit harsh on mr.stevenson. He wants questions answered about the violent and negative verses in the Qu'ran, and most do, and all we get is shallow or incorrect answers that address the issue, and eventually we get blocked, for trying to show him his inaccuracies or errors. Amein needs to know that his system on this thread is wrong, and maybe he should think long and hard in partaking in this type of discussion, if all he wants to hear is positive things about his position and no negative. That is not trying to get to the truth as he claims he is trying to do!!! God Bless, IGIT ==================== And one final comment to Mr. Alsuezi: I Challenge Mr. Alsuezi to unblock people whom he has already blocked form posting on this thread (sort of like releasing political prisoners)! Truth can never be destorted no matter what, and therefore I challenge him if he believes his belief in Islam is truthful and if he believes Islam is about the truth, then what does he have to worry about?! Mr. Stevenson