qveauriche, it's Xmas morning here and family time, but in the interests of peace on earth and goodwill to all people, here I am.
I agree with what you wrote. I was being deliberately extreme because there is developing an important issue. Just what rights do foreigners or even locals have in the new world which is developing with the USA as the pre-eminent power and burgeoning integration around the world with supranational power vested in the UN?
It wasn't a criticism of the USA. It was pointing out the directions such burgeoning power can go, one of which is to create to types of humans 'us' and 'them'. This whole game is as old as humans - far more shopworn than our discussion.
I was pointing out what Hitler came up with when he tried to define 'us' and 'them' and get it under control. 'Them' were sent to the gas chambers.
It's true that we are only in the early stages of takeover, but the process is underway. It is obvious that military decisions are made in hot pursuit and there is no calm judicial review and there is no possibility of that because actions are needed now. Even in those circumstances, approval up the line is required and the frustrating escape of criminal terrorists was a consequence of the care and need for approval for a strike.
So there has been military summary execution and that's an essential aspect of military action. The next stage, a military tribunal, is obviously a reasonable next step. It is impractical to conduct trials for 10,000 or so adversaries. My point is that there is a transition between barbarity, which is dominance by killing, and civil law applied in the calm of constitutional review.
I am obviously a supporter of Pax Americana as I am financing it with my investments in QUALCOMM and Globalstar. I don't finance things I consider immoral. Which is not to say the USA is perfect - it is far from it and the most evil barbarians are concealed within the ranks.
It was the idea of NO RIGHTS FOR FOREIGNERS which was so obviously glib jingoism which needed to be confronted. As Kayaker has pointed out, there are a few problems with that. There are 5 billion other people in other countries and I dare say that NO RIGHTS FOR AMERICANS in those countries would not be considered popular by Americans.
It's not just America which wants to take over the world, it's me! I am happy to do that via the USA, which as you suggest, has got better constitutional and social norms than most nearly everywhere. But 'taking over' has to be done in the right way. The Japanese style of the Greater Co-Prosperity Sphere or the Nazi Thousand Year Reich where unapproved people are murdered in millions are unacceptable.
The only way to do it is to transit to full and equal rights for all people. There are always going to be differences, just as citizens of Auckland have different rights from citizens of Manukau City [right next door], but those differences are limited and don't extend to national laws. Some people who live in a street have special parking permits for that street. But they don't have "NO RIGHTS". In the same way, USA citizens would have special rights which Aliens would not have. I'm not denying that. I'm just saying that the more extreme xenophobic jingoism isn't going to work in a globalized world.
Milosevic is on trial now for things like Srebenica, where males were murdered after being defeated. They had no trial. That was considered a war crime. What to do with Osama's troops? Who, in all likelihood, if released, will go straight back to their horror creation. They are not a national force seeking political power in the normal sense. They are essentially international criminal murderers. Thousands of them.
I would say a military tribunal is probably the best way to give them some approximate fair treatment rather than simply leaving them incarcerated indefinitely as potential terrorists. I would NOT be letting them go until I'd had a chance to see just who the heck is who and who is likely
go on to more murder.
There has already been the first death in action of Mike Spann who was trying to sort out who the heck was who. I would not have been surprised if all those prisoners had simply been killed rather than questioned, to avoid just such continuing mayhem. But that would make the USA and Northern Alliance the same as the Srebenica murderers. It is a dilemma and Mike Spann suffered the consequences of taking the civilized approach. The amazing irony is that stepping through the vast mayhem is John Lindh [Walker, Sulayman] to enjoy the full constitutional rights of being an American. It is simply amazing. The irony of the conflict being in part a USA civil war shows the globalized nature and mingled humanity we are now dealing with. There was an Australian or two on the Taleban side too. I suppose there have always been people mixed up on all sides of conflict, so even that is not all that unusual.
I am in favour of the USA, as victor in possession, to set up a government with a USA-decided constitution, perhaps with a UN supranational role [which I think requires the UN to be reconstituted to take over such countries which fall into mayhem and cease to exist as countries]. Like you, expansion of the USA seems a good thing to me. The British Empire was a force for good, though it's unfashionable now to say so. They did not enslave and murder - they basically used bribery, trade and support for particular local factions to bring many countries into their realm. When popular sentiment rose for independence, Britain withdrew. They tried repression, but unless one is prepared to take the Stalinist, Saddam or Maoist approach and murder any number of people, it soon gets too unpleasant and counterproductive to kill swarms of people.
The USA is now in the process of constructing an international realm and I'm an enthusiastic supporter. But that enthusiasm will disappear in a flash if NO RIGHTS FOR ALIENS became the rule. I know MarginMike didn't mean it that way, but he did say it, so I stretched what he wrote to an extreme. What he meant is what I agree with, that just as residents of Auckland have different rights from residents of neighbouring cities [such as library use, parking, dividends from city ownership of a power company, and a few other things], so, citizens of the USA would have different rights from citizens of other countries. Especially when the process of globalization is barely under way and people like Osama's gang are rampant.
Because of the USA constitution, I don't think the USA is a threat in any sense to worry about compared with the likes of Hitler or Hirohito's military. More like the British taking over in their empire days.
You asked which country other than the USA should have such power? Well, Britain did fine and brought civilisation to much of the world [including the USA]. New Zealand would be good too. But the practicalities of size would mean such small and tiny places couldn't manage the situation and it would go bad.
Part of the reason for the extension of British and now American power is that people recognize that they are better off with such rule than their local despots. Hence, I'm financing USS Enterprise and USA global influence and I am very happy with the results. I would not be happy to see NO RIGHTS FOR ALIENS and I don't think we will see that.
The USA will figure out a way to establish rights for aliens in a proportionate way. If they don't, then they will be no better than Hitler's jackbooted thugs and their power will evaporate as opposition grows in favour of the gentle care of local rulers. To the extent that the USA can persuade people around the world that USA Rulz OK, we'll all do very well and a new 21st Empire can rule the waves and a lot more besides.
However, I suspect that a revamped United Nations into a Federal system of self-governing states is a better way to handle the integration. The USA constitution and statehood provides a good model.
I'm happy with how my taxes have been spent in response to the attack on the World Trade Center twin towers and Pentagon. I am very sorry that Mike Spann was killed by those people. Now that there are thousands of prisoners of war, they need to be sorted out and dealt with. That's quite a project, especially to avoid further attacks like the WTC while maintaining some semblance of civilisation and avoiding a Srebenica approach.
Merry Xmas and here's to QUALCOMM's global success and a revamped United Nations, peace on earth, universal human rights and civilization with freedom as the byword.
Mqurice
PS: As you can imagine, I am not going to pay USA taxes if that buys me NO RIGHTS FOR ALIENS. No taxation without representation say I. I don't want magnanimous kindness from the Great and Superior Americans. I want constitutions, laws and rights. There are 5 billion of me. |
