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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Nadine Carroll who wrote (21247)	3/12/2002 11:10:27 PM
From: teevee	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

Nadine, The UN condemned Israel today for its military strikes against civilians and the illegal occupation and settlement of non Israeli lands; and called for the borders to be moved back to the pre 1967 war boundaries. The UN also mentioned that the world's view of Israel's standing and stature as a civilized nation is at risk. The full text should be available tomorrow.

To: Nadine Carroll who wrote (21247)	3/13/2002 4:18:06 AM
From: frankw1900	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

Nadine, Crudely, what I'd like to know is if there is a palestinian Christian left in Palestinian territory. What are their emmigration stats right out of the M East? I think the actual large pogrom/program in Mid East is that of muslim fundamentalists who want to kick out or destroy all 'infidel ' presence. Israel is the largest visible infidel presence. The palestinian "infitada' is another proxy war sponsored by governments and NGOs, and because of this Israeli-Palestinian peace can't be arranged until the sponsors are in some way stopped in their activity. This is an egregious over simplification but sometimes this sort of approach is useful. [Actually, I don't think it's an oversimplification now that I think about it. The situation has been overly complicated by commentary and the various lies partcipants tell.] It would seem from this point of view the european approach is wrong and the US approach is not focused enough. Logic of this point of view suggests that Israel should concentrate on totally destroying Hamas and like organizations and not vitiate its energy in retaliation for individual outrages. Logic of this POV suggests killing Arafat also, as by now it's very clear he is the point man for the pogrom/program. Logic also suggests killing his replacement point men also. Arguing that there would be no one in the palestinian camp to left to talk to is specious:there's lots of palestinians and I don't suppose for a moment many of them see the fundanazis as likely to give them a beautiful future and they'd be far more willing to act if lots of the fundanazis were killed. Perfectly Stupid Ideas have a lot less persuasive power if holding them gets a person killed - ultimately when situation becomes extreme (eg world 1940) there is no alternative but to kill a lot of the believers and especially their leadership at the end. (Getting to it soon before the WMDs become too widespread seems a good idea to me). The US could complement the Israeli effort by putting serious pressure on the state sponsors (including EU) of the proxy fighters to pack it in and by energeticly supporting the Israelis. After 9/11 the US has plenty of leverage against the Saudis if it wants to use it. Taking a run at Saddam Hussein fits in with this. frank@catamongthepigeons.alt