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To: Elroy who wrote (61845)	10/14/2002 2:07:23 AM
From: Tom D	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 77400

OT: How about Iran? There is a wealth of evidence in the book I mentioned at the end of posting #68144. But in case you don't want to buy that book or any similar basic introductions to Islam, I think I can document the concept by using Iran as an example. This BBC news story news.bbc.co.uk describes the enormous improvements in conditions for women in Iran since the U.S.-supported Shah was overthrown and replaced with Muslim leadership. In particular, note the quote attributed to Iran's president: <<President Khatami has said that, according to Islam, there is no difference between men and women...And last year a senior cleric, Ayatollah Yosef Sanei, made headlines when he declared there should be nothing to stop a woman becoming president or even supreme religious leader - a post generally believed to be ordained by God...Ayatollah Sanei said women's ''bad treatment'' since the Islamic Revolution contradicted the teachings of Islam. And he said it was wrong not to allow women to become judges or to accept them as full witnesses in courts>> This second link is to an interview of Dr Masoomeh Ebtekar: Iran's first woman vice president muslimedia.com Please note two things. First, we need to make a distinction between the writings of the Qur'an and how it has been twisted to support the agendas of chauvinists. The parallels to the Catholic church are quite striking. There are many progressive Christian religions that allow women positions of leadership---and then there is Catholicism with its premodern view of women. I suspect the same is true for Muslims. The Qur'an can be twisted to preserve traditional male authority, but its actually more progressive than the bible when it comes to women's rights. Second, I am not a Muslim scholar. I am curious enough about this faith to make an attempt to understand it. So if there are any Muslims on this thread, I would be happy to let them defend this argument, as I am sure that they can do it better than I can. Tom

To: Elroy who wrote (61845)	10/14/2002 2:34:29 AM
From: Tom D	Respond to of 77400

OT, and then how about Pakistan? Do you recall the inspirational story of Benazir Bhutto? I couldn't even get in to Harvard and she graduated and age 20 and then went on to become prime minister of Pakistan--the first women to ever hold the position of higher power in a Muslim country. storyofpakistan.com You are correct that it does seem outrageous the first time we learn that in some ways, some Muslim countries are more modern and progressive than the United States. It takes some education to get beyond the stereotypes the MindMeld described. Best regards, Tom