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To: elpolvo who wrote (10904)	12/31/2002 1:29:45 AM
From: lurqer	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 89467

would just feel more comfortable hearing what you just said coming from the mouth of an unbiased, studious, well educated muslim How about from the mouth of the Prophet? This is the ruling of Allaah and His Messenger, as the Prophet - peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him said: "Whoever changes his religion, kill him" - reported by al-Bukhaari, al-Fath, no. 3017. From thetruereligion.org lurqer

To: elpolvo who wrote (10904)	12/31/2002 10:35:08 AM
From: zonder	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 89467

i would just feel more comfortable hearing what you just said coming from the mouth of an unbiased, studious, well educated muslim... Hi elpolvo - I am no Muslim, but I have lived in ME for most of my life and would probably fit the rest of your criteria. I read the Quran (and the Bible and the Torah) and I can safely say that there is nothing in there that would support lurqer's suggestion that "The penalty for even attempting to do so [to convert a Muslim to another religion] is quite specific - death" I have read a bit of lurqer's posts to know that is an intelligent & informed poster, so this is by no means a general comment, but I feel he is influenced by the prevaling anti-Islam media craze of the moment. It's been a while since I read the Quran, but I remember that what it says is something like if a man converts from Islam to another religion, his wife and kids should be separated from him so as not to be influenced. I don't remember anything about no killing of the person who has renounced the religion. Actually, there is a part in the Quran that talks about "freedom of religion", about never forcing anyone for any religious belief. The parts that often get quoted on "kill enemies of Islam" etc are invariably about the stories of war, not about everyday life, when you are supposed to kill your neighbour or convert him to your religion. Also re missionaries - I would like to point out that they existed in quite a few Muslim countries and nobody felt any particular urge to kill them until now. I think we need to look at things in the context of the continuing polarization of East vs West, "us against them", etc. By the way, to address a similar concern - there is nothing in the Quran about no converting anyone by force to Islam, either. It says clearly that a man's belief is between him and God. A lot of the stuff out there that says otherwise is the so-called hadith, like what lurqer has quoted, what Mohammad has supposedly said. They are being used to maintain what I can only call the Inquisition of Islam. However, the Quran is quite moderate, although, of course, one has to smile at the occasional remark like "Don't have sexual intercource with your wives when they are menstruating" <g> Re Salman Rushdie - Fatwas were apparently issued when people asked questions about everyday life issues that were not explicitly covered in the Quran. It is a relatively new event that they include death sentences these days. Of course, this has no place in the Quran. It is sad the way religion gets twisted to goat the masses. Far be it from me to defend any religion, but I do feel that there is a bit excessive bashing on Islam these days, by people who do not have an understanding of this religion and its customs. I hope that helps. Although I cannot claim a profound knowledge on Islam, I would like to help for an understanding of the situation independent of what mainstream media pushes us towards.