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Politics : DON'T START THE WAR -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?


To: Crimson Ghost who wrote (3977)1/27/2003 12:04:11 AM
From: PartyTime  Respond to of 25898
 
Prideaux, an analysis worthy of consideration.

>>>At the moment, it's not easy to be allied with the United States, and it's going to get worse.<<<

Hijacked airliners brought down the world trade center and collapsed walls of the Pentagon; however, Bush, if he's not careful, could well be pushing a proverbial crane-dangling wrecking ball upon what the United Nations has built.



To: Crimson Ghost who wrote (3977)1/27/2003 12:31:55 AM
From: stockman_scott  Read Replies (2) | Respond to of 25898
 
What Do They Know And When Will They Tell Us?

Lead Editorial
Newsday
1/16/03
newsday.com

As more and more U.S. troops are deployed in the Persian Gulf, the prospect of an invasion of Iraq has taken on a grim sense of inevitability. But awar is not and should not be inevitable. And it certainly doesn’t need to be launched in a matter of days or weeks.

President George W. Bush has yet to make a compelling case to the nation or his allies for war against Iraq. Nor has he articulated in a convincing way the reasons why such a war must be waged now, instead of allowing United Nations inspectors time to determine whether Iraq has disarmed or can be rid of its weapons of mass destruction.

It would be irresponsible, arrogant and politically obtuse for Bush to rush into war without laying out a detailed case for why Saddam Hussein today poses an imminent threat to the nation and to the security of the Persian Gulf’s oil supply and why the best way to handle Hussein is through a war as opposed to robust containment.

If he can make the case, he must do it. If he is ready to go into battle, then the president must explain why the costs of going to war — in treasure and lives — are less than those of continuing the inspection regime with a credible threat of military— Continued from Preceding Page

force. For instance, has the administration adequately taken into account the possibility that if the United States attacks Iraq, Hussein, with his back to the wall, might well launch some kind of terror attack on the U.S. homeland with biological or chemical weapons ?

It is not enough for Bush to argue that Hussein should have voluntarily disarmed in the same manner as, for instance, South Africa. Of course, that would be preferable. But launching a war should be a last resort; if there are other ways of disarming Iraq they must be tried first.

Bush’s Gamble

Bush has been playing a risky game of chicken. He has gambled that, faced with the ominous military buildup under way — more than 150,000 U.S. troops already are in the Gulf — either Hussein will blink and fold or reluctant U.S. allies will resign themselves and go along with the war plans.

But the gamble may backfire, politically and strategically. Domestic and international unease at the prospect of war is rising by the week. In the latest polls, seven out of 10 Americans oppose a war with Iraq unless the United Nations gives its approval. In Europe and the Arab world, opposition rises to 90 percent or more.

The only way that Bush’s risky gamble could pay off and result in a decisive political victory for him would be Hussein’s improbable last- minute capitulation to the unrelenting military pressure Bush is putting on Iraq. But that pressure works both ways. If Iraq doesn’t give in, there will be equally unbearable pressure on Bush to use the troops he has deployed at great cost. A president who has put hundreds of thousands of troops in the field is a bit like someone who holds a hammer in his hand: Everything starts to look like a nail.

The international pressure on Bush to back off his war footing is mounting, and the administration has finally, if grudgingly, acknowledged it. On Friday, a possible compromise was shaping up as Britain and the United States seriously considered allowing UN inspections to continue in Iraq for several additional weeks. With such a compromise, Bush and his foreign policy team hope they will be able to make a stronger case with U.S. allies and domestic critics for military action if Hussein continues to prevaricate and quibble over details of the inspections — such as private interviews with Iraqi scientists.

But that compromise does not go far enough. There is an alternative, detailed in a report last week by the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace. It would entail an extension of the intrusive UN inspections for as long as necessary — possibly up to a year longer — coupled with a continuing threat of imminent use of force if Hussein were to renege on his obligations.

Save Money, Save Lives

To make that threat credible, Bush would need to maintain a large U.S. military deployment in the Gulf for as long as inspections go on. It would be costly — it takes roughly $1 billion a week to keep 150,000 troops in the Gulf — but it would cost far less, in dollars and lives, than an all-out invasion of Iraq, which could drain the treasury of $100 billion to $200 billion, not counting the inevitable human casualties.

And there would be other, intangible costs. Bush would have to do some fancy rhetorical footwork to justify such a major shift in posture, risking support from the hard-liners in his party. Congressional grumbling over the open-ended costs of maintaining a large U.S. force in the Gulf would be a certainty. A protracted military deployment using reserve units would put severe strains on the families of those involved — their jobs, marriages may be imperiled.

But the political gains would be equally compelling. Bush would gain considerable stature, here and abroad. He could argue, legitimately, that the intense military pressure he has put and will maintain on Iraq will pay off with better compliance with inspections. By holding the threat of war in reserve, Bush will maintain the fragile unity of the veto-bearing powers on the UN Security Council, whose cooperation he will need for a military action if Iraq ultimately fails to satisfy disarmament requirements.

Containing Iraq

By showing determination coupled with patience, Bush would defuse much of the criticism his stubborn push to war has generated. Most important of all, he will ensure that, as long as inspections continue, backed up by a U.S. expeditionary force, Iraq will be effectively contained, unable to develop nuclear weapons or use chemical and biological weapons it might still have.

If the goal was to defuse Iraq’s threat to the region, it will have been achieved. And if Hussein continues to balk to the end and war becomes finally inevitable, then the world just might stand with the United States rather than against it.

Copyright © 2003, Newsday, Inc.



To: Crimson Ghost who wrote (3977)1/27/2003 12:58:27 AM
From: LTK007  Read Replies (3) | Respond to of 25898
 
fine article George. Now the pessimist in me comments on this bit <<It's the beginning of the end of American empire. In historical terms, there are three basic factors
leading to the decline of empires. Take the Roman Empire, or that of Britain. A country overextends
itself. It becomes intoxicated with its might. Then, it becomes a militarist power that by sheer physical
force gets whatever it wants. That will exhaust its material resources>> History repeats itself, the cycle has yet to be broken,and if there is not a revolution of individualism in this country that breaks from the repetitive action of history nothing will stop this process of the Intoxicated with Itself Empire moving itself into exhaustion and collapse.
Dr. Marc Faber who i oft quoted, two years ago said the U.S. is the greatest power since the Roman Empire and will collapse like Rome, but faster, as history is moving in quicktime now.
The Extreme Right is what it is because Empire! makes their groins warm. A worthless lot, each and every one, "card-carrying" members of the Extreme Right.
i will say the same for the Extreme Left, as such i will not participate in any Peace demonstration organized by the group The Answer, they have an agenda, their philosophic roots be Stalinism(which happens to be Saddam's philosophic rooting).
But, in the end, the extremist, the nut-heads, left or right, i feel will bring all to a boil and the steam engine will blow to bits, and the good ship history enters again into a Dark Age, and the beat goes on and on and on.
Max, the Pessimist, because history has never ever learned from its past.



To: Crimson Ghost who wrote (3977)1/27/2003 2:12:47 AM
From: PartyTime  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 25898
 
Why does Bush, et. al. want everyone to believe what they're saying when they can't supply evidentiary substance to support their remarks? Baffling, ain't it? Where's 'dat damn beef!?!

gulf-daily-news.com



To: Crimson Ghost who wrote (3977)1/27/2003 4:31:28 AM
From: stockman_scott  Respond to of 25898
 
Country deserves tough love from citizens

By LYNN WILLEFORD
GUEST COLUMNIST
the Seattle Post-Intelligencer
Monday, January 27, 2003

I was 23 before I was finally able to vote in a presidential election and my first vote went to George McGovern for his courageous stand against the war in Southeast Asia. Americans who didn't support the war were considered unpatriotic and their love for their country was questioned. I had my say at the ballot box and not in the streets, but such slogans as "America --Love it or leave it" and "My country right or wrong" were hurled at anyone who disagreed with foreign policy.

Thirty years have passed and I'm getting more than a whiff of that same attitude in the ongoing discussion of America's role in the world. In the intervening years, though, I've become a parent and have a new take on this tension between those who agree with government policy and those who don't.

Every parent knows it's a pretty poor sort of love if you cannot find the discipline or the courage to stop someone you love from wrong or dangerous behavior. As a mother, it was my job to teach my child to share his toys and be kind to others. It was my job to teach him not to hit other kids, not to cross the street without checking for cars and not to touch anything with a Mr. Yuk label on it.

I instructed, nagged and occasionally punished my child because I loved him and I wanted him to grow up to be a good person who would play a useful role in the greater community. I would love him no matter how awful he was, but it was still my responsibility to guide and correct his behavior until he reached adulthood. When he broke the rules, I didn't get rid of him. I pointed out the error of his ways and worked with him on changing his behavior. Isn't this a sign of good parenting and a loving relationship? Why should it be any different with countries?

Continuing the family analogy, let's look at what we do if dad's drinking is out of control, little brother is hooked on crank or grandma's health is in jeopardy from obesity. A loving family member speaks up, even when everyone else wants to stay in denial to "be nice." The stakes -- a person's life -- are too big here. So if America has become drunk on power, are you the bad relative if you call attention to the fact and ask for an intervention?

This country was founded by people who didn't want to be told what to do, religious and political dissenters who may have loved their mother country but eventually spoke out about her deplorable behavior. Centuries later, America and "Mother England" still remain close. Think of it as Tough Love.

It is my right and my duty as an American citizen to speak out when I think my country has embarked on immoral or dangerous behavior. I do it because I love my country. Neither kids nor countries benefit from unwarranted praise, denial of problems or unconditional acceptance of all behaviors.

If I see my country refusing to share its toys, bullying smaller countries, telling lies or bragging about its riches in the face of others' poverty, I've got no choice but to give it a talking-to because it's too big to send to the Gobi Desert for a time-out.
______________________________________________

Lynn Willeford lives in Langley. Submissions for First Person, of up to 800 words, can be e-mailed to editpage@seattlepi.com; faxed to 206-448-8184 or mailed to the Seattle Post-Intelligencer, P.O. Box 1909, Seattle, WA 98111-1909.

seattlepi.nwsource.com



To: Crimson Ghost who wrote (3977)1/27/2003 10:58:25 AM
From: Ed Huang  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 25898
 
>>If the U.S. continues having wars -- yesterday with the Balkans, then with Somalia, Afghanistan, Iraq, then with North Korea, Iran, Saudi Arabia -- then it'll be the end of the United States as an empire. I can't tell you when. Some would say 10 years, some would say 20 years. But we're not talking 50 years or 100 years. This is not going to be the century of the United States.<<

I agree, the risk of being the beginning of the end of the US empire is very real once the US starts the Iraq war.

The great difference for this war than the other wars U.S. involved is this war is strongly opposed virtually by all other nations except the strong backing and pushing by Israel and a shaky ally Britain. And the US government also fail to get the majority support at home. Now we saw France and Germany united and confronting the US war move. I believe that a much bigger and stronger coalitions, including Russia & China and other countries join force against the U.S./Israel expansion is in the cards. The US may win the Iraq war but will lose its global political power and influence she has enjoyed for decades. And there's a high risk that it'll bring political and economical unrest at home and further heighten the risks of terror attacks to the country (some of the points in post #3268 of my brief summary / news digest about the costs and consequences of the Iraq war are more being a fact than speculation).

Unfortunately, we can hardly see any sign yet that Bush administration wants to quit the war.

P.S. Sharon is supposed to have a major victory in Israel's election tomorrow. Not surprisingly, Bush's attitude on war in State of the Union Address will be in line with what Sharon will call for.



To: Crimson Ghost who wrote (3977)1/27/2003 11:46:08 AM
From: ChrisJP  Read Replies (1) | Respond to of 25898
 
Saddam Hussein has committed terrible crimes, but so has the West. The Western sanctions have
killed between half a million and one million innocent Iraqi people -- and these are U.N. figures, not
my own, not propaganda.


The West did not kill these people !! Saddam's policy of not obeying the UN Resolutions killed these people !

PROPAGANDA -- is twisting this fact to make it seem like the West is to blame for Saddam's atrocities against his own people.

Chris