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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: JohnM who wrote (70796)	2/1/2003 12:03:00 PM
From: paul_philp	Respond to of 281500

Sullivan strikes me as yet one more illustration of a break down in traditional political alignments. Perhaps Christopher Hitchens is another. Kevin Phillips a third. These are folk who not only appeared to move from one alliance to another but are free thinkers, not comfortable in political alignments. Just give em a pedastal and step back. Frank, perhaps you know the answer to this question. My impression is that the left-right political distinction derives from the French Revolution. If so, and perhaps even not, perhaps it's time to retire it. John, Sullivan regularily confronts the anti-gay sentiment in the Republican party. As far as I know, he broke the story a week back when Bush nominated a Bob Jones type of the National AIDS Commission and within 24 hours that persons had 'withdrawn their name from consideration'. Wouldn't it be nice to think that smart people with big pedestals could be causing a political realignment of some sort. I tend to think that demographics cause those realignments but the early sheppards will certainly give it form. Paul

To: JohnM who wrote (70796)	2/1/2003 12:26:12 PM
From: stockman_scott	Respond to of 281500

What's in the new issue of very conservative magazine...? Message 18522269 <<...The latest issue of THE AMERICAN CONSERVATIVE (not yet online) carries a major editorial calling on Bush to fire chief warmonger Richard Perle. So opposition to the Bushie madness is not a liberal versus conservative thing. Rather it involves the oppostion of American patriots who value the traditions of the nation to a small group of neo-con fanatics...>>

To: JohnM who wrote (70796)	2/1/2003 12:40:55 PM
From: LindyBill	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

I assume that one way Sullivan has to answer this is just how politically salient his sexual status is so far as politics is concerned. You seem to have the same buildup of dislike for conservatives on sex that you do on religion. It is hard to categorize. Just based on the old "Who knows what lurks" idea. Nobody knows what most people really think. I personally believe that people are much more tolerant that they were a generation ago. But I think a public backlash has built up by a reaction to the "We're Queer, we're Here, and we are going to be your kid's Boy Scout Master" approach that some militants have taken. So if it makes you happy to spend time fulminating about the "Religious Right" and the "Conservative Homophobes," have fun. But you are never going to change any votes with it.

To: JohnM who wrote (70796)	2/1/2003 2:44:30 PM
From: frankw1900	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

OT: I don't know his views very well so it would be hard for me to place him. John, Andrew Sullivan wrote his thesis on the British philosopher Michel Oakeshott: imprint.co.uk I read a lecture he gave to the American enterprise Institute about Oakeshott but unfortunately it doesn't seem available at their website anymore. No, here it is cached by Google: 216.239.33.100 It's a fun read. It's very clear Sullivan was profoundly influenced by Oakeshott. Oakeshott is complex, to say the least. I only came across him a couple of month's ago. Can't say a lot. Regarding Sullivan's view on politics and homosexuality. Here is a revue of his book Virtually Normal. brothersjudd.com Gives you the flavour of the differneces amongst many conservatives. .......... Left, Right. Sort of like porn. Know it when we see it but not very helpful a lot of the time. Don't know the origins. Whigs, Tories - opposing sides of the House? I haven't got much time this weekend. Gotta run. Post a tiny bit more later.