Silicon Investor (SI) -- The First Internet Community

STOCKTALK

We've detected that you're using an ad content blocking browser plug-in or feature. Ads provide a critical source of revenue to the continued operation of Silicon Investor. We ask that you disable ad blocking while on Silicon Investor in the best interests of our community. If you are not using an ad blocker but are still receiving this message, make sure your browser's tracking protection is set to the 'standard' level.

Non-Tech : Raptor's Den -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Abner Hosmer who wrote (7913)	2/14/2003 1:41:10 AM
From: macavity	Respond to of 10157

You talk like we are morally obliged to foreswear the use of force against nations like Iraq and North Korea Not speaking for Velo here, but I do not think that is the argument. The argument is that when one nation - the most powerful - The United States, says that it feels no longer obliged to behave in a certain way, we should not be surprised when others copy this behaviour as it is in their self-interest to do so. N. Korea have reneged on their promise to not build Nuke Stuff. Fine, do not give them aid - I agree. Let them stew on their own. The problem is they will export this technology. What should not be a surprise is every country now saying that they will act pre-emptively if they feel threatened. If the US claims the right to pre-emptive attack, then perhaps others can claim that right? If the US no longer acknowledges the right to not use nukes in a first-strike capacity, then perhaps others can claim that right? If the US no longer feels obliged to follow previous undertakings relating to WMDs,then perhaps others can claim that right? You can lecture Iraq and N Korea all you like. But N Korea has over the last 9 months said and done the exact same thing w.r.t. its international multilateral obligations that the Bush administration has done. For its actions N.Korea should have all benefits of its previous compliance removed - agreed. Perhaps Iraq might claim the right to use pre-emptive force citing 300,000 troops and equipment in the Gulf as evidence that it feels threatened. My argument, and I think that of others, is one that if we all behave like this the world becomes less safe. To the accusation of calling America a bully. This is probably due to the fact that diplomacy and deterrence is being used as an option vs. a well-armed N.Korea but War is seen as the only option for Iraq. N.Korea is a major seller of missile and WMD technology - remember those intercepted missiles to Yemen? Made in North Korea stamped all over them. Hence other leaders may now think that if I too have a nuke, the US will not send 300,000 troops to my backyard to beat me up. After all one would not want to bring a knife to a gun-fight, would one? As to cleaning up garbage. Please stop this self-righteous crap. We are not going to start to point out whose trash belongs to whom caused by the Cold War machinations. After all Saddam and Bin Laden were not exactly creations of the KGB, were they now? It is simplistic and fatuous statements like that this that drives us non-americans (lilly-livered pinko renegade commies that we are) nuts. France and Germany's behaviour viz. Turkey/Nato is unforgiveable. The alliance is a self-defence alliance and allowing a member the means of self defence is what it is all about. But to look at the world now, and claim that it has nothing to do with past US actions or policy is, excuse me, a tad simplistic and infantile in belief. Yup the aggressors have taken note. They are all building nuke capabilities as we speak. Warheads from Pakistan, delivery systems from N.Korea. I am glad to see that there is a growth market out there in something. Now if only they could get an IPO sorted and we could put this into the Nasdaq, it would be back to the good ol days. The 300,000 troops are in the wrong area Mr Bush, IMO. But as Cheney so rightfully put it - "Iraq is do-able!" Dr Strangelove is in The House! -macavity

To: Abner Hosmer who wrote (7913)	2/14/2003 1:43:13 AM
From: mishedlo	Read Replies (5) \| Respond to of 10157

Sorry but we are not fighting WWII again. This is a terrorist war and is vastly different. In fact one of the causes is that we stuck our noses into too many places it did not belong. We trained Bin Laden (our own CIA did) We supplied weapons to Hussein We supplied chemicals to Hussein We have a one sided policy towards Palestinian issues We have troops in Saudi Arabia for no reason We fought a needless and stupid war in Vietnam We fought a needless and stupid war in Korea We act like an arrogant know it all We are telling lies about what this war is really about We are plagarizing 10 year old documents and presenting them as evidence for a war in Iraq. We are threatening the world with first use of nuclear weapons, not in retaliation but as preventative measure. We are stupid enough to call a dangerous nuclear opponent a pygmy. We have no sense of diplomacy. We do not care what the world thinks. We threaten the world ith trade sanctions if they do not support us. We supported a corrupt Shah of Iran. We are not interested in inspections, nor do we want peace. We are only interested in war, regardless of the consequences, militarily, environmentally, or monitarily. We insist we know what is in the best interest of every other country on the planet. I could go on but I will leave off with one more thought. We are 100% FN wrong. It is no wonder 3/4 of the world thinks we have our heads up our arrogant asses. M