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To: yard_man who wrote (233496)	4/4/2003 1:04:28 PM
From: zonder	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 436258

But that is not inconsistent with my belief that we shouldn't submit or be bound to a supra-national bodies "laws" or "resolutions." Are you suggesting that humanity go back half a century, before the time of international treaties and agreements? [edit]

To: yard_man who wrote (233496)	4/4/2003 1:22:10 PM
From: benwood	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 436258

My problem with what happened is the process, not the result (that is, the 'inevitable' war). There was no failed diplomacy, because the goal for at least 5 years (for Rumsfeld and the rest of the cabal) as been war with Iraq. In that light, the "humble failure" was really a blazing success. The French proved themselves equal idiots by making their own ultimatum which simply let our hand appear to be forced at their expense. I view this entire mess as a death rattle of the ability of states to simply ride roughshod over the world. That was the norm in the colonial centuries, fell back significantly in the last century with a couple huge attempts by Japan & Germany to make a go of it, and now here we are in what I believe will be the last significant push for the foreseeable future. The old ways die hard. This "push" we are making may end up being one of several that occur, some by other nations -- we are certainly giving the moral green light for justifying many misadventures. I just hope this escalating death rattle of the old ways where a country can say my way or the highway doesn't take long to resolve and doesn't spiral out-of-control. In that context, however, the death rattle is actually part of a bigger process. It will be difficult to get to the next logical step of civilization where the cooperation and trust between nations equals that between States of our own Union, but that day will come.