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Politics : Stop the War! -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Lazarus_Long who wrote (12652)	4/12/2003 1:44:07 PM
From: Jorj X Mckie	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 21614

Oh, and why, if the Israelis are such good buddies of ours, why did they plant a spy (Pollard) in US Navy Intelligence? Yes? I bet that the US has spies in Israel too.

To: Lazarus_Long who wrote (12652)	4/12/2003 9:44:08 PM
From: AK2004	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 21614

re:The difference is that it was not intentional. The Liberty incident looks like it was. we shot at civilian car recently when it was identified as civilian but it failed to stop in time. US (probably you included) considers it as justifiable. When small nation is fighting overwhelming arab forces and see heavily armored ship (potentially capable of destroying Israel key defenses) appearing close by without US warning Israel of it's existance you seems to think that Israel should have given Liberty benefit of a doubt. Even with 20/20 hindsight Israel's actions were correct. If you want to blame anyone then blame those who send the ship into battle zone without notifying friendly forces. re: It was easily recognizable as an electronics listening ship because of the large amount of electronic gear visible on deck and superstructure not really but it was easy to identify british aircraft considering that Iraq did not flew any missions at all. Can we assume that british aircraft was shot down intentionally so brits would not see US torturing and executing Iraqi civilians? Gustave and your new boddy crawford would buy that but the reality is that it was an acidental shooting by friendly fire. re: There has NEVER been a congressional investigation. as Robert pointed out there were more than one investigation by US and more than one investigation by Israel. As far as congressional hearings then neither CIA nor military nor president have power over congress. The was no justification for congress to conduct liberty hearing re: Testimony of Dwight Porter. Dwight Porter was US ambassador to Lebanon in June 1967. He states that on June 8 CIA men showed him radio transcripts, translated into English, which recorded talk between an Israeli pilot and his home base. The pilot protests that the ship he is attacking is American; the home base orders him to attack anyway. I have heard about it and, in fact, do not doubt that one of the pilot saw american flag and refused to fire. The IDF commanders do not have luxury of been wrong about potentially hostile ship in the waters. For example, recall that Israel never fired on red cross until arabs figured out that the best way to get closer to IDF is to paint red crosses on their cars. It is not a clean war there where all of the good guys are wearing white hats. re: I never believe conspiracy theories without good proof so where is the proof that is the only proof that counts and that is advanced US notification of US ship in the area. re: Doesn't make us bad guys either. well, the way you put it does make us look like bad guys re: After 35 years people are starting to believe it wasn't an accident. They're starting to listen to us. there is some sad truth to that. The more we forget what actually happened there the more we inclined to believe some insane conspiracy theory. Who knows maybe few years from now hitler and stalin would turn into heros......

To: Lazarus_Long who wrote (12652)	4/13/2003 5:27:58 AM
From: craig crawford	Respond to of 21614

the attack on liberty was one of the most serious peacetime attacks on a u.s. navy vessel in history. it was the highest casualty rate of any attack on a navy vessel in american history. (7 out of 10 on the liberty dead or injured in the attack). the aftermath of the attack bore the distinction of being the only time in american history that a peacetime attack on a u.s. navy vessel did not merit a formal congressional investigation. ask our zionist israel-first friends if that is just a coincidence!!