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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Hawkmoon who wrote (97770)	5/9/2003 8:59:58 PM
From: KyrosL	Respond to of 281500

>>seeming lack of planning for reconstructing << The extend and thoroughness of the looting set back reconstruction by months. The plan was to rely largely on the existing civilian infrastructure. You can't do that if the civilians have no chairs and desks to sit on and their offices have been reduced to smoldering ruins, not by bombs but by looters eager to get back at Saddam's symbols of state. For example, the oil fields which SF protected so superbly from being blown up, are inoperable because a lot of the pumps, pipping, and other equipment has been stripped bare by looters. I guess our soldiers took at heart Rummy's attitude that a little looting doesn't hurt, plus there were too few of them anyway to properly secure the fields and other public property without shooting everybody in sight. The bottom line: it's the unintended consequences stupid! (not you Hawk).

To: Hawkmoon who wrote (97770)	5/10/2003 3:40:23 AM
From: jjkirk	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

I totally agree with your second sentence, Hawk...people are happier when working and making their own way. I too could become impatient with the pace of restoration of commerce, civil affairs, and infrastructure if, as the media reports, we are still in the discovery and organization phases. IMHO a military organization is what is needed to get things done over there at this point...civilian beauracracies move too slowly...and they need the security provided by the military working with the local policia.. Were I king, there would be a seamless handoff from the military to Garner's organization with the military hanging around to support him. That may be the plan, but, if we can believe what we read in the press, the military is a reluctant partner...if not for that, a Marine or Army captain with his own headquarters/service/communications company could have Garner's palace up and running in about half a day...Army and/or Marine Corps heavy engineers, transportation, and service groups could be the the early prime movers getting the infrastructure back on line and ready to hand over to ngo contractors or iraqi civil authority....we actually need more, not less Halliburton/Brown Root type contractors...Frank Purdue should be over there with a hundred North Carolina Mexicans teaching Iraqis how to raise and pluck chickens by the millions...and DeVry Institute and the Univ of Phoenix could be opening trade and business schools in every town and village.... But, lest we forget, change ain't easy...it is like pushing a rope trying to change your wife or your husband...how much more difficult for Garner et.al. to change an entire culture to embrace freedom, democracy, and capitalism...tough indeed... Perhaps we should be slow to speak ill of their efforts if we are not walking in their moccasins. In the meantime, may we have pray for wisdom..."He is a wise man who does not grieve for the things which he has not, but rejoices for those which he has."...Epictetus (A.D. 135) Ciao! jj

To: Hawkmoon who wrote (97770)	5/10/2003 2:20:24 PM
From: KonKilo	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

I have to admit that I'm rather disturbed by the seeming lack of planning for reconstructing Iraq and restoring order and commerce. Hawk, I've written and deleted three replies to you, because they all came out too sarcastic. Knowing you for the honest man that you are, you deserve better than that. Before the invasion, when thoughtful folks would question the rush to war, we were told that twelve years is not a rush. When we proposed a more peaceful alternative, we were bullied and called unpatriotic. When we asked what the post-war plans were, we were told that we would be informed when the time came. Well, it is becoming plain for all to see, that there really is no viable plan and that any good will that came from our ousting Saddam is quickly turning to hostility. Would things have turned out better had we had a rational national discussion instead of the bellicose agitprop? No one can say for sure now, but I do know that an America where honest and significant dissent is shouted down and marginalized is not the nation our forefathers envisioned.