Silicon Investor (SI) -- The First Internet Community

STOCKTALK

We've detected that you're using an ad content blocking browser plug-in or feature. Ads provide a critical source of revenue to the continued operation of Silicon Investor. We ask that you disable ad blocking while on Silicon Investor in the best interests of our community. If you are not using an ad blocker but are still receiving this message, make sure your browser's tracking protection is set to the 'standard' level.

Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Dayuhan who wrote (101487)	6/13/2003 10:18:29 PM
From: Nadine Carroll	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

Bollocks yourself, Steven. Yes, the situation was very complicated and the Zionists weren't innocent lambs. But European anti-Semitism is not an invention of the Israelis, now or then, and neither is the absolute double standard with which the world judges the situation -- pointing fingers at the plight of the poor poor Palestinian refugees whom their brother Arabs have kept in squalid camps for over fifty years, while conveniently forgetting that there were any Jewish refugees, just to take one example. Any other part of the world, there would have been a war, there would have been cease-fire negotiations, and there would have been a negotiated peace. Instead, the Arabs decided to hold their breath until they turned blue rather than recognize Israel. Fifty years on, they are mostly very blue indeed, and Europe says, tsk, tsk, you Israelis are such hard asses, why can't you be more conciliatory, it's all your fault. As Tom Friedman likes to say, fifty years ago, the Asian countries said to their people, give up democracy and we'll give you prosperity. Now they are prosperous and starting to democratize. The Arab countries said to their people, give up democracy and we'll give the Arab/Israeli conflict. Fifty years on, they are poorer than ever but they still have the Arab/Israeli conflict.

To: Dayuhan who wrote (101487)	6/13/2003 10:54:39 PM
From: Hawkmoon	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 281500

the issue was not just that Jews were moving in, the issue was that they were moving in with the openly declared intention of declaring sovereignty over the area on terms that were absolutely unacceptable to the existing population. The Palestinians didn't seem to mind when the Hashemites came in and established ABSOLUTE SOVEREIGNTY over the area of Jordan, now did they?? Do you think the occupants of the region minded when the Ottoman Turks ruled the area for 400 years?? Do you think whoever was living in Palestine (combination of peoples) minded when the Arabs originally occupied the area? I mean, come on now Steven.. I'm not excusing it, nor do I even believe in it, but Zionism, as you define it, was representative of the period in which it appeared. In the US, it was "manifest destiny".. European imperialism, and empires fighting to conquer the colonies of their rival empire. And besides, the Arabs felt no remorse about making Jews (and everyone else) live under Islamic law.. Why is that any different than what Zionism represents(ed)?? Hawk

To: Dayuhan who wrote (101487)	6/15/2003 1:01:54 PM
From: michael97123	Respond to of 281500

Steven and Nadine, You and Nadine are both right. It would be best now if the parties put aside these historical grievances and realize that they both have been victims of european/ottoman colonialism and oppression. Two nations, same land. Best you can expect in a peace agreemment is the Clinton/Camp David with slight adjustments of land and people and jerusalem as a dual capital. 1967 is as far back as you can go. Arabs cant get anything more and if the israelis try for more, they will guarantee more war and risk their moral demise. But in the end, as always, the ball is in the palestinian court. And that court involves reigning in of the terror groups for both political and moral reasons. Then and only then can things get any better. And despite the current violence i have some hope for Abbas and Dahlen to pull this off. mike