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Politics : Formerly About Advanced Micro Devices -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Joe NYC who wrote (175841)	10/2/2003 9:53:43 PM
From: i-node	Respond to of 1571068

Joe You nailed it. You have set out precisely the reasons we had to do what was necessary in Iraq. This is complex issue that the American people might well not have been capable of understanding a priori. The idea of installing a shining example of democracy and capitalism and freedom right in the center of the Middle East can only have beneficial consequences. While there are certain costs associated with doing so, long-term, it DOES get at the root of the terrorist problem. While Bush can be criticized for his methods, ultimately, he will not be criticized for the success. What the Democrats hate most about it is there will zero doubt about the fact that this accomplishment was a result of the leadership of their most-hated icon - George Bush. It is just KILLING them.

To: Joe NYC who wrote (175841)	10/2/2003 10:09:34 PM
From: Road Walker	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 1571068

Joe, re: Anyway, that is my read of the neo-con plan: - attack Wahhabi/Talliban on the battlefield of Afghanistan - cut of the source of their funding ("charities") - make Saudi's cut off the funding as well - hopefully, sign up Saudis against Wahhabi - provide alternative (Iraq) - give another shot to resolving Palestinian conflict (low probability of success Don't you think your scenario is a bit contrived? A bit of self deception to justify ... John

To: Joe NYC who wrote (175841)	10/3/2003 10:02:22 AM
From: Alighieri	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 1571068

Anyway, that is my read of the neo-con plan: - attack Wahhabi/Talliban on the battlefield of Afghanistan - cut of the source of their funding ("charities") - make Saudi's cut off the funding as well - hopefully, sign up Saudis against Wahhabi - provide alternative (Iraq) - give another shot to resolving Palestinian conflict (low probability of success So much speculation, so little evidence. The most offensive festering issue, the Palestinian/Israeli conflict, receives no attention at all from the administration. If there are two sides to Muslim resentment of the west, of which America is the focus due to its prominent role in foreign policy, is the fact that we support Israel unquestionably (which means in right or wrong doing) and we become complicit in what Arabs (Muslims) view, probably with justification, as unjust and onesided behaviour. Ameliorating (notice that I don't use the word "solving") this single issue provides far more payback than the Iraq war ever will, if I even stretch my imagination and allow that it could have a slight probability of a beneficial effect in the ME. Remember that Turkey is a Muslim country in the ME, a Nato member, a democracy for a number of years, and I ask you, what effect has that had on other countries in the reqion? The very fact that we are being sold this romantic notion of a democratic Iraq as a prerequisite to democracy throughout the region should answer that question amply. The second issue is the Muslim fundamentalist culture of hatred of anything western. THe war in Iraq actually feeds this hatred and plays into its belief that a violent war of culture is required to keep the west from contaminating the ME with it's "moral corruption". There is so much more that can be said about the adminsitration's "methods" in its approach to foreign "policy" and the incredibly negative effect these are having on America's ability to re-shape and influence now and in the long term. The recent report I posted on this thread gives but a taste of this. Latly, anyone who says that bush hatred is irrational is being dishonest. There never have been clearer and more concrete points to be made to disapprove of an adminsitration's policies whose effects can tangigly be measured at home and abroad and whose effects will be felt for a very long time. It's all the time I have for now... Al