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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Nadine Carroll who wrote (116958)	10/16/2003 12:58:04 AM
From: Bilow	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

Hi Nadine Carroll; Re: "In places where there have been liberalization, such as Bahrain ..." The Bahrainis have approximately an equal position with the Israelis, of course they're not obsessed with blowing them up. By contrast, the inhabitants of the Gaza strip are still dirt poor (figures from CIA website): Per capita GDP: Bahrain: $14,000 Israel: $19,000 Gaza: $ 600 It would be very convenient if the Gaza strip could discover oil under itself, or manage to remake itself into the next banking empire like Beirut. But you and I both know that it ain't gonna happen. Your opinion is that it's not Israel's fault that Gaza isn't as wealthy as Switzerland. Fine, have it your way, if you like. But that won't save Israel. Re: "Hate to tell you, but both rights exist already, the first totally, the second partially. ... And Israeli Arabs are first class citizens." Like your claims that Jews and Moslems can get married in Israel, you're just lying again. Re: "It would be good if you knew about the real Israel before you spout off about how "racist" it is." I've never claimed that Israel was racist. You're arguing by setting up the most flimsy of strawmen, to put words into your opponents mouth. In fact, Israel's not racist, at least not any more than any other country, including the US. What I said was that the US once had racist laws on its books, and that Israel now has religious laws on its books. And you admitted that this is true: "Mq, talking about Israeli "anti-miscegenation" laws is silly; there is nothing racial in these laws. You can't find a more racially mixed society than Israel, and the Palestinians are not far behind. It has to do with religion, and the control of the Orthodox establishment over the practice of Judaism in Israel, much to the disgust of the 85% of Israeli Jews who are "secular". For various historical reasons, the original Labor founders conceded this control, and the Orthodox have been expert at making themselves into essential swing votes to keep the control. Actually, this expertise just failed them at the last elections, but their power is well established and can only be lessened gradually. And the government of Israel has other matters on its hands right now, or this would be a MUCH bigger issue in Israeli politics." #reply-19395005 Re: "Mexican Americans who are citizens are first class citizens too; that doesn't mean the US allows free immigration to all Mexicans." The US doesn't allow free immigration to any nation. Israel, by contrast, allows free immigration to ALL members of a particular religious group. The US does allow immigration, on an equal basis, to relatives of Americans of all kinds of descent. Israel DOES NOT allow immigration to relatives of Arab Israelis on an equal basis to that of relatives of Arab Jews. How many quotes from Israeli sources would you like for me to produce? Here's a start, 964 hits gleaned straight from the Jerusalem Post: google.com 216.239.57.104 -- Carl