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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Jacob Snyder who wrote (117048)	10/17/2003 12:28:33 PM
From: epicure	Respond to of 281500

Excellent summation

To: Jacob Snyder who wrote (117048)	10/17/2003 3:48:03 PM
From: Hawkmoon	Read Replies (2) \| Respond to of 281500

But our response, to feeling less secure, was a greatly increased willingness of Americans to use force in Muslim areas, which is the opposite of what Al Queda intended. Indeed.. hopefully to have some impact upon straightening out the corruption and socio-economic stagnation evident there. Which is why I have to keep asking why the Democrats in this country FAIL to get the "big picture" here... They B&M about Bush's actions in Iraq, griping that no WMDs have been found, when the POINT HAS BEEN ALL ALONG that bringing down Saddam is an integral step towards "shuffling the deck" in the Middle East.. Look what has been accomplished thus far.. We're seeing militant muslims killing muslims in Iraq, thus demonstrating for the entire Islamic world to see that these "Jihadists" have little compunction towards killing people of supposedly of their own faith. We also have shown France, Russia, and Germany as being nations that are willing to support totalitarian regimes for their own advantage. Yet, where were Amnesty International and other human rights organizations who have never hesitated in haranguing the US for supporting dictators in the past? Why did they not denounce these nations for their support of Iraq?? AWOL!! And now the Democrats are all trying to make political hay out of Bush not obtaining UN support, when we all knew that France and Russia were never going to.. And they are now trying to get Bush to beg for something the other UN members have never intended to pony up (given their economic malaise), namely financial support and troops... They could just care less, knowing the US will be forced to do it.. Yet, they expect to participate in Iraq's recovery by obtaining lucrative contracts from them? Go figure!! The democrats need to stop undercutting our troops and US will in making a lasting change in the Mid-East.. We may fail, but we'll CERTAINLY FAIL if they continue their devisive (if not seditious) behavior. About the only example of a Muslim nation producing prosperity, in modern times, is Malaysia. The U.S. should seek to promote the Malaysian model. I'm not so sure about that. Companies flocked there because Malaysia was attempting to become a major off-shore banking center.. And then Soros pummeled their currency mercilessly and they been declining ever since as a preferred labor market.. We'll see what happens when Matahir resigns... We certainly don't need his sort of hate-mongering and race baiting... But we all know that these kinds of political tirades work rather well when the government is flailing and need to deflect people's emotions from their own economic misery. Unfortunately, probably the only way to discredit the Islamists and their ideas, in the eyes of the people in Muslim nations, is to let them fail at governing. Possibly.. but a whole lot of blood will likely be spilled in the process, with a good portion of it likely being American should we see even greater terrorist attacks against the US. There was a point where arguing about the war was relevant prior to military action. But now they need to all just shut up about why we're there and just do the right thing with regard to providing them all the moral, political, and logistical support they require. As you noted, Bush has followed a policy of pro-active change within the Mid-East, not waiting as we did in the '30's for the gathering storm to unleash its eventual wrath. Hawk

To: Jacob Snyder who wrote (117048)	10/17/2003 4:11:09 PM
From: Maurice Winn	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

Jacob, Malaysia is not impoverished because they have swarms of Chinese living there, who maintain the secular work ethic and temporal concepts of life and loving and will have influence the local culture. reference-guides.com To achieve the same in other Moslem countries would mean importing lots of Chinese, which won't happen. Malaysia also has wealthy, productive, Chinese Singapore just over the fence. Which no doubt helps the Malaysian economy a lot. Islamic Jihad states are full of mayhem and MADness. Until the Islamic Jihad MADness is ditched by the Moslems, they'll stay poor. All across the Moslem world, it's the same. Even with vast oil wealth to kick start their economies, they are wallowing. Singapore is wealthy with no oil wealth and no natural resources to speak of. It's the Singapore model the Moslems need to copy, not the Malaysian. Mqurice