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Politics : Foreign Affairs Discussion Group -- Ignore unavailable to you. Want to Upgrade?

To: Nadine Carroll who wrote (118146)	10/31/2003 9:41:31 AM
From: GST	Respond to of 281500

<GST, if we don't stay and restore order, no one will.> It is far from clear that we are able to restore order -- the trend is going the other way. Nothing is impossible and after a period of time and many more deaths perhaps we will prevail. But this was a bad plan from well before we invaded -- it was a bad plan the day that Cheney began to pronounce our intention to act unilaterally. The odds of success with or without the UN from the start were a crap shoot -- but by invading unilaterally we ensured a much higher cost in flesh and blood for our troops and we substantially lowered the odds of prevailing.

To: Nadine Carroll who wrote (118146)	10/31/2003 1:27:13 PM
From: GST	Read Replies (3) \| Respond to of 281500

Top Israeli Officer Says Tactics Are Backfiring Fri Oct 31, 5:29 AM ET By Molly Moore, Washington Post Foreign Service JERUSALEM, Oct. 30 -- Israel's senior military commander told columnists for three leading newspapers this week that Israel's military tactics against the Palestinian population were too repressive and were fomenting explosive levels of "hatred and terrorism" that might become impossible to control. In remarks that suggest a dramatic split with the approach of the current government, Lt. Gen. Moshe Yaalon, chief of staff of the Israeli armed forces, said that crackdowns, curfews and roadblocks in the West Bank and Gaza Strip (news - web sites) were crippling the lives of innocent Palestinians and that the military's tactics were now threatening Israel's own interests. story.news.yahoo.com

To: Nadine Carroll who wrote (118146)	10/31/2003 1:31:47 PM
From: GST	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 281500

....<"We're in a more serious situation that the U.S. was in Vietnam," said reserve Brig. Gen. Yiftah Spector, one of the most decorated fighter pilots in Israeli military history. Spector was grounded as a flight instructor last month after signing a letter, along with 26 other reserve pilots, calling the military's targeted killings of militants in crowded civilian neighborhoods "illegal and immoral." Israel's military policies in the Palestinian territories, Spector said, are "opposing everything I was raised on" during his career in the air force. While Yaalon's staff attempted to make a distinction between his concerns and those of the pilots, military officials and analysts said frustration and disillusionment within the military -- not only over tactics that punish innocent civilians but also with the stalled peace process -- had spurred large numbers of troops, from infantrymen in the field to reserve officers to the chief of staff, to speak more openly against the policies of Sharon's government. "We feel there's a real problem here," said one military officer, who agreed with the chief of staff's assessment. "The public should be made aware how we feel. There should be a public debate in Israel on where we're going and how far we can push the Palestinian public." Yaalon also criticized the government's decision to expand the barrier being built between the West Bank and Israel deep into Palestinian territory to encompass more Jewish settlements and cut off tens of thousands of Palestinians from their agricultural lands and families. The Finance Ministry estimated this week that the barrier would cost about $2.3 billion, more than three times the original estimate.>> story.news.yahoo.com