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To: X Y Zebra who wrote (48846)	11/12/2003 2:14:08 PM
From: Original Mad Dog	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 57110

I have a Sequoia too. Great vehicle. When Toyota adapts its hybrid technology to the SUV's (reportedly the Highlander will be offered in 2005 with a Prius-like hybrid engine), the SUV gas mileage stigma will recede. Right now we use passenger cars for commuting and the Sequoia only for kid hauling and trips. If I were sitting in Saudi Arabia right now, one thing I would be thinking of is how the hybrid engines (and perhaps fuel cells and other alternative powerplants) are on the verge of taking away my oil market. In ten years, if the hybrid continues to evolve and give us 60 MPG, the oil market as we know it will collapse. The resulting economic dislocation could set off spasms of terrorism, but the resulting lack of dependence on Saudi Arabia will be a good thing in the long run. One of the reasons the Japanese plants in the U.S. don't share the GM/Ford problem is that most of them are not unionized, so no UAW to thwart quality improvement and cost cutting efforts. But a big part of it is also a design advantage. It's not all the union's fault.

To: X Y Zebra who wrote (48846)	11/12/2003 2:33:20 PM
From: MulhollandDrive	Read Replies (1) \| Respond to of 57110

How come these manufacturing plants are not dying... is the hand of the UAW working "its magic" here ? or... as you point out, the engineering/design capabilities of ford & gm totally dead...? i think it's both i would like to be more forgiving of the engineers by saying that it is possible because of the choke hold of the UAW, not enough money was properly spent for research and development, but i'm not so sure. but you certainly can't blame the UAW for the fact that detroit seems to have had a history of creating new markets lee iacocca practically single handedly saved ford with the mustang, and later chrysler with the introduction of the minivan, and same with the SUV....detroit seems to do well at creating new markets but not holding onto them....that comes from diligence in fit and finish and product line innovation, perhaps the UAW's hand is evident there....u.s automakers have a tired, aging workforce that seems more concerned about health benefits than making sure they put out a good product. but still, i believe "the buck stops here" meaning management. The Toyota trucks are bullet proof and drive great.... too bad they are getting a tad expensive... yes...and you can see why a strong dollar isn't in the u.s interest .... but even with the higher price, consumers are smart enough to realize "pay me now or pay me later" meaning an american truck, poorly constructed, cheaper though it may be at the time of purchase, will cost more in lost resale value and maintenance....so golly gee, miracle of miracles, toyota actually has some pricing power with their trucks. if i were in the truck market right now i would almost certainly buy a tundra, pay more up front, keep it garaged, and drive the hell out of it for 10 years<g> Thank you.... HO HO HO... -gg btw, i take no pleasure in my assessment of the u.s. automakers, in fact it pisses me off mightily that what was once a symbol excellence of american engineering and production is now viewed as a dying breed ps.. as great as the porsche cayenne looks, i just can't bring myself to be driving around a "box on wheels" with the porsche logo... :)